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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 5:51 am 



Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 3138
Thanks for actually reading that wall of text :wink:

Deadlift is a great, complete exercise on which you can progress very slowly and very safely, but still get great benefits out of it.
I am doing this as the main "free weight" exercise during the week, having started again from 50 kgs (ahah!), but adding 2.5 kgs every two weeks (So, currently lifting 110 kgs).
You can also see it as a perfectly reasonable, "real life" exercise: need to lift something, help a person, etc.? Deadlift sessions will turn out to be exactly what you needed.
In general, anyone who spends the long hours typing stuff on a keyboard can only benefit from a strong back and core, obviously.

Re: beer and such...I am half tempted to do another necrobump, but an hilarious paper I read (IgNobel candidate, even!) suggested that spirits and "kräuterlikörn" (herb-based spirits/liquors: Jägemeister and so on) are less problematic for diets because they are not made with carb-rich ingredients, unlike beer/whisky/vodka :wink:

Generally speaking, as long as you count the calories, alcohol is not a big deal (I mean: a shot of straight whisky is 100 kcalories or so, for the stronger ones).
However, the general rule I know is that alcohol turns into easily absorbed sugar very quickly, and can thus turn into extra reserves of body fat also very quickly (...and go away very quickly, I guess).

Consume those calories quickly and you should be fine, I'd say.
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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2021 12:28 pm 


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My opinion on the deadlift mirrors that of the minority naysayers from the past: "Why do an exercise that takes more than it gives back?" I do admit it can make you look cool, though.

For the lower back, the classic used by football coaches everywhere is the good morning. It's not the kind of thing you try to make the numbers go up on, intensity is a terrible idea as the sinews of the spine are tiny and aren't built to handle that kind of shear force concentrated at one point. Light weight for high repetitions, and waking up curled up like a shrimp is what it's for. It's right there in the name~


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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2021 4:26 am 


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Location: Chicago
Yeah ,I fucked myself w/ deadlift today. Smart enough to not finish the set and just walk away. Has to do w/ the bar. I'm okay w/ dumbells or that other weird ass bar that goes around you. I'm not down and out but I might switch up my days and swim tomorrow. So yeah ,fuck dead lift. I just don't have the posture for it.
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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2021 6:05 am 



Joined: 25 Jan 2005
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I swear, I wasn't trying to bring you bad luck or something!

....but posture training is something you should also do, from time to time, and especially since you're quite tall (and, I guess, an ectomorphic/mesomorphic type with long limbs).
Anyway, yeh, swimming is the perfect subsitute to everything, and I am not biased in writing this just because I am an ex-swimmer (of course).
I plan on swimming a bit when I will be on holiday, in a few weeks' time, if only because a few laps at a gentle pace act as long stretching sessions.

..In perfect Chinese style, my gym started minor renovations for 2-3 weeks without updating customers about the situation.
This means that I need to train outdoors for these remaining three weeks of the 23-week cycle.
Wuhan has a typical East Asian, monsoon-driven summer, and mosquitoes are big and aggressive at night.

I am training in the early morning with 30 celsius and 85% humidity, which is surprisingly not so hard (OK, I handled worse weather in Guangzhou).
Same workload with calisthenics and running, but I swapped weights and machines with fixed-sit rowing, using one of those machines you can find in parks and public spaces (surprisingly, in good shape).
Rowing while looking anime-like summer skies, the deafening sound of cicadas as background music, is not so bad.

I must be losing 3-4 kgs per session via dehydration, though, so I am always bringing plenty of water with me.
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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2021 12:41 pm 


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Yeah, a very deep squat is necessary to have a more vertical back on the deadlift. I had chronic issues with starting the squat decades ago, which were corrected by modifying my posture so that it'd be putting compressive force on my spine, instead of shear force. Shear force = a good morning, but with way more weight than even grizzly bears recommend as max.

The players in the NFL flat out don't deadlift, the power clean is their core torso exercise. Many deadlift record holders didn't train with the entire thing as their primary movement... It's abnormally popular, honestly. I attribute it to its coolness factor; the name, the high amount of weight on the bar, people seeing how cool you are when you squeeze your tummy on a full lunch. Good mornings in comparison are totally lame - the name's weak and sissy, you're prancing around with a tiny amount of weight on the bar, bleugh. "Deadlifts", now that's powerful.

Every deadlift performed coulda been a squat. Unless one is a competing power lifter, that's a terrible trade imo.


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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2021 4:21 am 


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I swim 3000 yard (not 3k b/c they measure the pools in yards here) twice a week. Took a while to build back up to it. When I was in Tokyo I was doing 3k twice a week for most o the time. Also, jogging 12k twice a week, in 30 degrees with 80-85% humidity so I know what a PITA that is. I was working nights at one point and jogged home from work at midnight. Rung my shirt out when I got home and there was a puddle of sweat. Disgusting. Oddly though, Tokyo doesn't have a ton of mosquitoes despite having a shitty rainy season.

So, the lower back is bad enough to probably not quite get into squats just yet. I'll do Bulgarian Split Squats in the meantime. They definitely don't get the coolness factor but who the fuck cares. My gym is 90% dudes anyway, just like any indoor business in Silicon Valley. The trick now is to keep my cardio game on point while doing a harder weight regimen. Should be able to do it -- 7 mile jog tomorrow.

On that note, I'm getting some good TV in on the treadmill / indoor bike. Rewatching Watchmen and I think it's better the second time. This fucking delta variant may get mask mandates back on the table though despite the fact that my county has probably the lowest new cases per 100k rate in the country.
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Last edited by GaijinPunch on Fri Jul 23, 2021 3:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2021 11:47 am 



Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 3138
BryanM:


Popularity notwithstanding, deadlifts are used in some sports as a form of training to, for instance, shovel people around (e.g., rugby, in which it is more or less legal to do so).
I kept the movement in my routine because I used it when playing rugby (and squatting, too), and...cycling.

My cycling coaches made claims about "complete functional movement" and "total control on bicyle when handling (parabolic) curves", and frankly I was fine with not reading the relevant literature (don't train with academics: it's "read the peer-reviewed papers in the reading list" as soon as you *look* puzzled).

Generally speaking, I think that functional movements tend to develop a type of popular diffusion that becomes more or less arbitrary, once people start using them without really having a function for it.
I guess that sport psychologists may have published studies on this topic, but I suspect that I really don't want to know more (as in: "yes, people take the *dead* in *deadlift* seriously").

I do shovel/move stuff around, from time to time (long story...), so I am keeping it in my routine, for now.
Oh, and Good mornings look nice but honestly, NFL-related stuff...I must support my prejudices against yankee sports with tempo, sorry!

...but honestly, never heard of them and the gym's closed, so I must wait before trying.
Can I use a name like "bear killer moves of deadly death!!!1!" or something, though? If somebody asks me, it's an exercise that uncle Vladimir P. does when getting ready to kill puny western spies :lol:

GP: swimming yes, but I guess: free style?
I haven't swum in ages, but I would mix styles a bit and use butterfly as a "pure power" exercise (3k/1 h as a long distance effort, too).

Jogging...yes, that kind of experience, though I am not doing more than 3-4k these days (fixed seat rowing+jogging in this weather=certain death, honestly).
Guangzhou was sometimes 35-36 celsius and 93-94% humidity (and mask!), which means that I would swim in sweat after 5 minutes of running (and TONS of very scary mosquitoes chasing me around).

Re: general...cardio is always good, at the end of the day (unless you have a heart attack because you overdo it, of course).
Weights...really, "haste makes waste" may be the only relevant truth, for all I care. Bryan's 5%/95% ratio is a timely reminder that there is no hurry to increasing strength.

Random: I admit that I usually read when cycling, listen to music when using the treadmill (no headphones, though), and just empty my head and soul when rowing (really, it's my "meditation-like" exercise).
I watch next to no TV (Bryan don't get me started on animu PLZKHTX), but I think that I'd kill myself easily, if I dare reading/watching something on a treadmill.
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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Thu Jul 22, 2021 1:22 pm 


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The power clean is very popular with those in contact sports. Just... gotta own the rubber plates and a safe place to drop them. Any gym worth a damn should support them, or by god have a gigantic swimming pool at least. Planet Fitness was always a hilarious meme with their "lunk alarm" - god help you if you clinked some metal or had to breathe or god forbid make a noise out of your mouth while lifting, as a siren would go off and a poor scrawny nerd from the front desk would have to walk up to you and say "mister... mister you're being too loud."

Of all the simple machines, the lever has always been looked at with awe. Complimented throughout time with remarks like "these things are like hacking the universe." And indeed, being able to trade distance for power is very cheaty indeed. The theoretical perfect lever, with one end right on top of the fulcrum, would output infinite power (with the slightly inconvenient aspect of having zero displacement on the thing it won't be moving.) Subjecting such forces to one's spine should be done with care, an empty barbell for 10 or 20 reps is plenty to start adjusting to them.

Ah, as I mentioned earlier "good morning" is a whimsical joke on how one's mornings feel after heavy work with the movement. An honest translation would be "spine crusher" or "spine destroyer" but normies would look at them and say "isn't that too sissy an exercise for such a cool name?" And thus, the whimsy.


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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2021 3:46 am 


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I do 1/3 Freestyle, 1/3 Elementary backstroke, and 1/3 Breast stroke. I'm not that great and don't claim to be, but I can go for a solid hour w/o a break unless I have to piss which actually does happen regularly.

I was able to jog 5 miles today before the back started acting up. Probably stupid. I'll find out in the morning. Might switch to a swim tomorrow to give it some time to heal.

But, feeling better... and eating a ton of food so if in a month I don't feel any stronger I will break something in the house.

EDIT: Back not too bad (it was actually more of a burning butt cheek). Some ibuprofen and a lot of sleep helped. I will probably take it easy today. They really need to figure out this aging thing. :)
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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Fri Jul 23, 2021 4:13 pm 


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Was out of town for two weeks. Rather than obsess over finding time to work every day I pick a day midway through and just do a single maintenance day. Keeps me sane, gets me some alone time, and my endurance doesn't take a hit.

I'm used to only doing two exercises a day - so to do everything in one go is a lot. I go just hard enough to get through everything.

Yesterday was pull ups and handstand push ups. My gains with ROM on the HSPU have been insane since I simply switched it to my pull up day. I had been struggling with it for years on my push up day and it took me far longer to move it to another day than it should have. That said there is no stopping me now.

One step closer to a strict one arm push up. Archers are still my work set, but I've discovered I can do sliding one arm push ups which are just a little harder. Can do four on each side so not quite ready for them to be my work set, but close.

Here is an example of a sliding OAPU if you're curious:

https://youtu.be/6bXV576zK08?t=39
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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2021 4:26 am 


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I'm confused -- so you do two exercises while in the gym -- that's the workout? How long does that take? How many sets and reps?
So if you go 6 days a week you do 12 exercises total?
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 Post subject: Re: Weightlifting/exercise thread
PostPosted: Sat Jul 24, 2021 9:08 am 



Joined: 25 Jan 2005
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GP: that's actually an excellent workout and, besides, we are not competing on anything, are we? :wink:
The one conjecture I have is at some point you may want to dab with the butterfly stroke, since you should have a apt body for it.
Butterfly is good for short, powerful bursts: once you learn the technique, you can try a few (short) laps as a way to increase a "strength-oriented" (well, for the upper body) phase in your swimming sessions.

BryanM: power cleans are the province of front rowers, in rugby (i.e. the guy in the first row of the scrum).
My sole personal objection to the exercise is that I would kill myself with the bar alone - they require more coordination that I already have.
Maybe a shame, as the local gym seems to support shouting as a way to promote group bonding among the bros (I swear, the kids are always !"#%ing loud, when they lift).

The ugly truth is that when it comes to weights, machines are the safest way to exercise, for me. If it is not my own weight, I tend to have balance issues easily.
I accumulated 3 concussions so far (car accident + 2 devastating tackles in rugby), and I get to pay an ultimately small price for them: lowered sense balance and stiff necks on rainy days (...for now).

Stevens: ROM (=Range Of Movement, right?) on HSPU, but how much? Balance is a killer for me, so I am afraid that I will never learn this one, but do you have a set-up to go below your palms?

Spammer part:

...tried out a few lever exercises today by hanging from an horizontal bar at the park, hoping not to have vertigo and fall. Surprisingly for me, I could even perform a sub-optimal version of the horizontal lever (I mean, this one). I suspect that some of these basic static strength exercises should now be easy for me, as long as balance requirements are low.

It does help that I am down to 70 kgs, all of a sudden (less fat for sure, but it must simply be the weather). Now, if only the excess skin would magically disappear...
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