GameCube

Anything from run & guns to modern RPGs, what else do you play?
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Marc
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GameCube

Post by Marc »

Talk to me about Ninty's little wonder machine.
Dug mine out this weekend and have spent several hours revisiting some of my favourites.
Sadly, the thing looks like dogshit on a HD TV. In general, that generation of consoles is fucked unless you have a CRT lying around. Earlier machines now all have solutions to work in HD, and though some might gripe about, say, the SNES mini, it does a good enough job for 95% of us. It's muddy, blurry, and Ninty need to get on a Cube mini ASAP. OR, port this stuff to Switch.

F-Zero GX: I still don't like that thing where you push a craft too far and it starts to rotate on the spot while not actually turning, it irritated me in X and even more so here given the speed of the game. Having said that, surely this is one of the finest arcade racing games ever created. It's absolute chaos, but there's none of the AI bullshit that's always plagued the MK games - if you know what you're doing and do it well, you will win, simple as. It's a shame there weren't more Nintendo/Sega collaborations, this is pure brilliance.

Wave Race Blue Storm: It's OK... but the physics simply aren't a patch on the original. The water on the N64 has real heft and volume about it, this feels more like one of the Riptide GP games. It's fun, but it lacks the nuance of the original.

Luigi's Mansion: God I remember the reviews when this was the launch title. All praising it and awarding 7/8's but always with that 'this isn't a proper Mario game' snark. Well FUCK those people. It's a great idea executed wonderfully, it's the best Ghostbusters game that's never existed, it's rammed with character and detail, it looks gorgeous, and as far as I'm concerned a lost classic.

Rogue Squadron: Bloody brilliant, the Star Wars game I always dreamed of as a kid. Unfortunately, the trench run is now a big grey soup. Again, this needs a proper HD makeover, a big meaty single player campaign with none of the bullshit that surrounded the Battlefield games. The Cloud City level in particular is amazing. It's also far fucking harder than I remember, or maybe I just suck more.

I've still got PN.03 to dig into, all I remember about it at the time was that it felt weird not being able to strafe, and I picked it up quite late in the machine's life and probably didn't give it enough time. Eternal Darkness is on the shelf, but I'm guessing it probably sucks these days. I never got on with Metroid Prime first time around, loved the atmosphere and world, hated the controls.

I've just had the DK bongo game arrive, will probably rebuy Sunshine, and need Burnout 2 for it. Maybe Extreme G3 as well, I remember enjoying that at the time.
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Re: GameCube

Post by mycophobia »

Marc wrote: Eternal Darkness is on the shelf, but I'm guessing it probably sucks these days.
I played this earlier this year for the first time since it came out and I put about 5 hours into it before dropping it. The atmosphere is top notch, the sound design specifically is unbelievably good. Super creepy. And the insanity effects are still really cool. However, the combat and level design get really really repetitive and the game just kind of turns into a chore by the sixth or seventh chapter.
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Re: GameCube

Post by bigbadboaz »

Yeah, 640x480 doesn't scale up well to HD at all. I'll ask even though it really won't help: are you running the component cables?

Sadly, running these games hi-res in Dolphin is looking like the only solution. Nintendo recently made an announcement claiming there will be no VC on Switch, and explicitly denying the rumors of GameCube ports. Take that as you will.

Much as I loved F-Zero and X (so sadly underrated due to its looks), GX never clicked for me no matter what the consensus. Just too chaotic and somehow lost the control subtlety I loved in X. Blue Storm I loved, but I had to push through a fairly long period of also feeling it didn't compare to the first. I say give it another, longer, shot. I don't feel that way about the water physics at all. Ultimately I think I had to get over the huge difference in aesthetics more than anything. But once it clicked: love it love it love it - as much as the first, which I also hold in extremely high regard.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Despatche »

Mr. Driller Drill Land is a Great Ruler above all of these pleb games.

Don't forget 1080 Avalanche to go with your Blue Storm.

Should be noted that there are two Rogue Squadrons on GC, Rogue Leader and Rebel Strike.

The Phantasy Star Online games are at their best on GC, and III is a GC exclusive.

There's an interesting Star Soldier game I still need to check out. I think there was an Adventure Island game too.

Lost Kingdoms is a pair of interesting From RPGs. I haven't personally played them, but I've been meaning to recently, and I've always heard good things.

Odama is a hilarious Japanese warfare-themed pinball thing, made by the guy who does things like The Tower, Seaman, and Aero Porter.

Nintendo Puzzle Collection is interesting. It has a port of Dr. Mario 64 (never released in Japan), what was rumored to be a 64 sequel to Panel de Pon (and supposedly got turned into Pokemon Puzzle League), and a sequel to Yoshi's Cookie. It's claimed that the Yoshi's Cookie sequel was developed from scratch, but it could very well have been some 64 game that got shelved. The Panel de Pon sequel alone is worth the price of admission (which was originally less than a regular GameCube game), as I'm to understand it has a number of improvements on the original Pokemon version.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Obiwanshinobi »

So another "lists" thread sees daylight. Two actual exclusives hardly ever namedropped on such occasions: Pool Edge (have yet to play it myself) and Tube Slider (way too easy from the start, as if there was no rubber banding to the A.I., pleasant enough gameplay & presentation).
I like the Space Raiders title better than Space Invaders: Invasion Day. Fun times.
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Marc
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Re: GameCube

Post by Marc »

Yeah I need to pick up 1080 again - though as with Wave Race I do seem to remember not enjoying the 'Cube iteration as much as I had the N64 original. Odama looks... interesting. Found a used copy going for a reasonable price, wasn't there a microphone or something with it though? Can it still be played without that?

I actually had Drill Lane back in the day alongside my Panasonic Q... lovely console, though I do remember not realising that you needed a separate memory card for an import machine and getting all my UK data wiped when I used it in the Q.

Was playing some ISS2 yesterday, a pretty forgotten yet quite interesting footy game. These carried on with the more arcade-orientated style of the original SNES and N64 versions, and this still plays quite well. Much prefer it to where the Pro Evo series has ended up today.

Got the DK bongo's over the weekend - Donkey Konga is pretty good and even the kids like playing this. May have to pick up the platform game for these - anyone any impressions?
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Re: GameCube

Post by qmish »

Baten Kaitos, Baten Kaitos: Origins - interesting jrpgs with progrock ost
Eternal Darkness - that horror game with 4th wall break moments
F-Zero GX - great Sega & Nintendo racing collab
Geist - if concept is interesting for you, as you are ghost or smth like that and you possess stuff.
Gotcha Force - fun for fans of Gunpla.
killer7 - suda51's magnum opus (even if some prefer silver case or other stuff). i often compare it to Guy Ritchie's Revolver, if you watched that.
Lost Kingdoms 2 - as mentioned above curious title
P.N.03 - misunderstood game, i suppose? it really shows japanese game design as "you do what we need you to do". Aesthetically i like it.
Odama - as explained above me..
Doshin the Giant - DAT ACOUSTIC GUITAR SOUNDTRACK!!!
Giftpia - (japanese only) research if you study legacy of Love-de-Lic developers
Kururin Squash - fun puzzle
Zoids - if you like such stuff
Metal Arms Glitchin the System - perhaps...
Timesplitters 2, Timesplitters Future Perfect - thats what i call enjoyable console fps
Bloody Roar: Primal Fury - meow! fighting with animal transformation
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Marc
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Re: GameCube

Post by Marc »

bigbadboaz wrote:Yeah, 640x480 doesn't scale up well to HD at all. I'll ask even though it really won't help: are you running the component cables?

Sadly, running these games hi-res in Dolphin is looking like the only solution. Nintendo recently made an announcement claiming there will be no VC on Switch, and explicitly denying the rumors of GameCube ports. Take that as you will.

Much as I loved F-Zero and X (so sadly underrated due to its looks), GX never clicked for me no matter what the consensus. Just too chaotic and somehow lost the control subtlety I loved in X. Blue Storm I loved, but I had to push through a fairly long period of also feeling it didn't compare to the first. I say give it another, longer, shot. I don't feel that way about the water physics at all. Ultimately I think I had to get over the huge difference in aesthetics more than anything. But once it clicked: love it love it love it - as much as the first, which I also hold in extremely high regard.
Yeah unfortunately it's via the component cables hooked into an adapter that plugs into a headphone-type jack on the TV - only has two of those and 4 HDMI. I've got a scart to HDMI adapter, but isn't the GC's SCART cable monstrously expensive for some reason? I'm guessing that it really wouldn't improve quality much either. Might be time to see if anyone I know has a spare CRT - I've a ton of good PS2 stuff that also looks like utter ass on this TV.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Immryr »

i think you're getting confused between component and composite. the gamecube component cables are really expensive and give the best possible picture quality.

i don't think ps2 games look that bad via component on an hdtv either, but yeah, probably best on a crt.
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Re: GameCube

Post by qmish »

Immryr wrote:
i don't think ps2 games look that bad via component on an hdtv either, but yeah, probably best on a crt.
not sure about hdTV, but looked pretty good on 1080p Dell monitor
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Re: GameCube

Post by GaijinPunch »

Despatche wrote: The Phantasy Star Online games are at their best on GC, and III is a GC exclusive.
Blue Burst on the PC is what PSO I & II Plus should have been. Too bad it was too little too late by then.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Marc »

Immryr wrote:i think you're getting confused between component and composite. the gamecube component cables are really expensive and give the best possible picture quality.

i don't think ps2 games look that bad via component on an hdtv either, but yeah, probably best on a crt.
I am indeed, though I've just realised that I have component cables for the Wii - wonder if they'll look any better thought those?
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Re: GameCube

Post by FRO »

Marc wrote:Sadly, the thing looks like dogshit on a HD TV.
Look into one of these:

https://eongchd.wixsite.com/gchd-by-eon

I don't have one yet, but from all the review on YouTube and around the 'net, it's a fantastic solution. I'm planning on getting one at some point, though currently, I still rock a CRT in the living room for my GC and other systems so I can do S-Video. Works great for my needs, but for streaming and recording, the HDMI solution will obviously be much more desirable.

As for the console itself, I never had a big GC library until more recently, but I adopted the GC as my first console that generation, and didn't regret it. There were definitely some good games on there, and I didn't even go for the major first party stuff, like Smash, Sunshine, Luigi's Mansion, etc. I got turned on to Animal Crossing via friends, and dove into that, as well as Capcom vs. SNK 2 EO, Ikaruga, Buffy the Vampire Slayer: Chaos Bleeds, and a few other games that held my attention during that time. I use mine more for the GB Player these days, mostly because I'm focusing on GB games for my blog & YT channel, but I have picked up a number of GC games over the last couple years that I'd like to put some time into. Good little system.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Despatche »

GaijinPunch wrote:Blue Burst on the PC is what PSO I & II Plus should have been. Too bad it was too little too late by then.
BB added some cool items like SmartLink, but Episode IV is not at all interesting and BB doesn't really add any more than that. Episode IV wasn't even part of the BB box, you had to wait and buy that separately at first, so BB is really just some cool items. I mean, I guess that's what you meant? I don't think anyone ever treated Plus as anything more than a v1.2.

Too little too late for a GC or Xbox release, maybe. BB lasted for a good six years with nothing but bugfixes and events/event items, and really only died because Sega said so. Not that anyone really likes supporting two (soon to have been three) games at once...
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Re: GameCube

Post by bigbadboaz »

Marc wrote:I am indeed, though I've just realised that I have component cables for the Wii - wonder if they'll look any better thought those?
How big is your set? When I said 640x480 didn't scale well, that was largely due to size. On my 55", it's just too damn big and blurry. For those of you playing on monitors or more bedroom-sized sets, maybe there is indeed a workable solution.
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Re: GameCube

Post by GaijinPunch »

Despatche wrote:
GaijinPunch wrote:Blue Burst on the PC is what PSO I & II Plus should have been. Too bad it was too little too late by then.
BB added some cool items like SmartLink, but Episode IV is not at all interesting and BB doesn't really add any more than that. Episode IV wasn't even part of the BB box, you had to wait and buy that separately at first, so BB is really just some cool items. I mean, I guess that's what you meant? I don't think anyone ever treated Plus as anything more than a v1.2.

Too little too late for a GC or Xbox release, maybe. BB lasted for a good six years with nothing but bugfixes and events/event items, and really only died because Sega said so. Not that anyone really likes supporting two (soon to have been three) games at once...
The BB servers were never close to as populated as the DC or GC ones were. While it did last a while, it was very sparse for the last 2/3 of it's life cycle. I moved out of the JST timezone which made playing it, bizarre, to boot. The resolution alone though would make me chose it over any of the home console variants.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Austin »

F-Zero GX is an amazing game and probably the one I go back to the most on the Game Cube.

Luigi's Mansion is nice. I missed out on it back in the day but played through it for the first time a few months ago. I was surprised at how fun it was and how well it holds up. Definitely worth playing.

The Game Boy Player is probably what I use the Cube for the most these days.
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Re: GameCube

Post by mycophobia »

starting to feel like Twin Snakes is superior to MGS. I've only played them once each though
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Re: GameCube

Post by Jonny2x4 »

The bad rap that TTS gets, while based on some valid criticisms, is often exaggerated or blown out of proportions. Yes, first-person aiming kinda breaks the difficulty in some of the boss battles, but MGS1 was never the most hardcore stealth action game to begin with and I still found the game to be pretty difficult if you're going for the Big Boss rank (which requires you to not only play on Extreme, but also set the alert mode to instant game over) due to the routine patterns they adapted from MGS2. I didn't mind the redone cutscenes that much, since it's more in-line with the subsequent games in the series, but the redone voice acting and script changes were for the worse. Also, it would've been nice if switch between Snake's default outfit and the hidden tuxedo suit was much easier between playthroughs.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Square_Air »

Got to share my respect for the Capcom 5 (err... Capcom 4). Resident Evil 4, Killer 7, and Viewtiful Joe are all essential and their best versions are on the GameCube. I don't really have enough experience with P.N.03 to judge it, but it seems the reception to it is really mixed, so I'll have to give that some time one day to see what that situation is all about.

Another Mention has to go to Resident Evil (Remake) which easily rivals 4 in quality and is the best classic style Resident Evil game IMHO. I feel like it's a given to list the good first party titles, so I'll skip this since we all know the suspects. Metroid Prime, Kirby's Air Ride, and F-Zero GX are all fantastic Second party titles. I also really like Spiderman 2, even though it's quite flawed. The movement in Spiderman 2 is so excellent it makes even the mediocre sections of the gameplay seem exciting.

On another note, I've watched a lot of Ribbit King gameplay and I think I need to pick this up. It's super frog golf, what isn't there to like?
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Re: GameCube

Post by Jonny2x4 »

P.N.03 has a bit of a learning curve, since it uses Resident Evil-style tank controls with mandatory auto-aiming for your attacks and you strafe with the shoulder buttons. It kinda reminded of God Hand, but I found the game to be a borefest even after mastering the controls, since the levels are just a series of similar looking corridors one after the other.

Dat ass tho'
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Re: GameCube

Post by Bananamatic »

Jonny2x4 wrote:Yes, first-person aiming kinda breaks the difficulty in some of the boss battles
you can snipe the entire heliport from safety and then just jump down in the hangar instead of having to go around, the game simply wasn't meant for mgs2 mechanics and the bosses are the smallest problem
Jonny2x4 wrote:due to the routine patterns they adapted from MGS2
fun fact, if you disable the guards entirely during an alert (shoot both arms, destroy their radio) they try to escape to a different area through a door
except some places don't have doors so they just start walking around in circles because they didn't bother adjusting the mgs2 mechanics in any way

same for the rope climb, you can just not use the rope and repeatedly fall down and grab the next pipe to get down safely
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Re: GameCube

Post by Obiwanshinobi »

While multiplatform titles get recommended here, I might admit enjoying the 'Cube versions of Beyond Good & Evil, I-Ninja (file under "genuinely funny"; as the majority of its ilk tries hard to be, this one verily is) lately and - lust but not least - the original, evergreen Burnout (among its other virtues, split-screen works a treat).
I suppose the likes of SSX 3 or NBA Street V3 are as good on GameCube as anywhere else, although I don't really play these.

If you think much of any that-gen console Sega-developed titles, you can safely approach the 1st Super Monkey Ball, Beach Spikers (one and only home port known to me) as well as Billy Hatcher and the Giant Egg.

P.S. Whoa, having typed "flight GameCube" in the English Wikipedia main page search tool, I just found this Rei Fighter Gekitsui Senki title.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Steamflogger Boss »

@OP: I actually think the Xbox is pretty livable on newer tvs as long as you have a ypbpr cable. It is mostly a CRT generation though, I'd agree.

But anyway the Gamecube. So yeah it has the best Fire Emblem game, our lord and savior, Path of Radiance. I would have multiple Gamecubes forever just for that game.

It's probably just nostalgia but give me SSBM over any other entry. Same with MKDD. These are STILL some of my party games of choice with friends. The only drawback to MKDD is no AI w/ more than 2 human players. Kind of a bummer. MK on Wii U is at least livable, albeit kind of a Sonic Allstars Transformed clone. At least it's much better than that POS MK Wii.

Mario Sunshine is goofy but fun. Metroid Primes are deece.

F-Zero GX is...okay...definitely a bit hectic.

Mr. Driller Drill Land is great, one of the big reasons to bypass region lock.
qmish wrote: P.N.03 - misunderstood game, i suppose? it really shows japanese game design as "you do what we need you to do". Aesthetically i like it.
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PN03 is fun enough, do most people overlook it because of teh boobies and ass? I never really see it talked about much one way or another.

I played a lot of this Bloody Roar game with friends as a kid, but find it hard to go back to now.
Marc wrote:
Immryr wrote:i think you're getting confused between component and composite. the gamecube component cables are really expensive and give the best possible picture quality.

i don't think ps2 games look that bad via component on an hdtv either, but yeah, probably best on a crt.
I am indeed, though I've just realised that I have component cables for the Wii - wonder if they'll look any better thought those?
Yes but like another poster mentioned it only goes so far, especially if you are plugging directly into the tv and using the tv's scaling. Anything much bigger than 40'' would be a no go, imo.

I have many good to great scalers and deinterlacers but I still only play PS2 on CRT. Gamecube I don't mind on some newer displays.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Kiken »

Steamflogger Boss wrote:
qmish wrote: P.N.03 - misunderstood game, i suppose? it really shows japanese game design as "you do what we need you to do". Aesthetically i like it.
Bloody Roar: Primal Fury - meow! fighting with animal transformation
PN03 is fun enough, do most people overlook it because of teh boobies and ass? I never really see it talked about much one way or another.

I played a lot of this Bloody Roar game with friends as a kid, but find it hard to go back to now.
Most people overlook PN03 because of the awkward controls and the sterility of the level design. Going in, I thought it was going to play more like Ratchet & Clank, but combat in the game is far more stiff (not being able to move and fire simultaneously seems to be the largest hurdle to get past). It took me about 8 separate attempts for the game to finally click.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Steamflogger Boss »

That's a fair point, the game looks very bland. The gameplay is fairly rhythmic once you get used to the controls. It's been many years since I've played it but I think I beat it twice (I know I did at least once).
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Re: GameCube

Post by qmish »

"bland" or, in opposite, "very stylish", if you are into german minimalism and such

also choreography, imho its more "beautiful" than bayonetta (which is more "sexy")
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Re: GameCube

Post by Jonny2x4 »

Bananamatic wrote: you can snipe the entire heliport from safety and then just jump down in the hangar instead of having to go around, the game simply wasn't meant for mgs2 mechanics and the bosses are the smallest problem
I always thought that was intentional though. REX Hangar, the last area in the game before the final series of battles with Liquid Snake, has a pair of hot and cold pipes that helps you change the temperature of the PAL key without having to backtrack to previous areas. I thought it was pretty nifty design.
fun fact, if you disable the guards entirely during an alert (shoot both arms, destroy their radio) they try to escape to a different area through a door
except some places don't have doors so they just start walking around in circles because they didn't bother adjusting the mgs2 mechanics in any way
Didn't know that. I need to try that the next time.

The way reinforcements work in TTS was also quite weird. MGS2 was designed around tight corridors and most of the maps were connected via doors, so reinforcements tended to come from exits. But in MGS1, almost all of the maps with enemy soldiers are mainly connected via elevators, so reinforcements tended to simply spawn from off-screen. It becomes quite a hassle in TTS, since to kill a soldier in that game you have to aim for their heads in first-person, but the moment you switch back to overhead view, you have to deal with another enemy coming from the same direction that wasn't there before. It's quite frustrating.
same for the rope climb, you can just not use the rope and repeatedly fall down and grab the next pipe to get down safely
Need to try that too next time.
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Re: GameCube

Post by Zen »

Although I thought it was a great little console, the GameCube was where I feel out of love with Nintendo.
I felt wary of their early pitch for "shorter" Zelda's. Double Dash didn't do it for me, Zero GX, although very impressive, got too messy too quickly, Wind Walker was not the Zelda I wanted
(though looking back now, it was a brave move and perhaps ahead of its time), Mario Sunshine I enjoyed but I couldn't shake the "gimmick" feel.

Most ire is reserved for Wave Race: Blue Storm.
Wave Race 64, is my most played game. Its handling is sublime and its arcade sensibilities appeal. The physics are remarkable, the presentation excellent.
Wave Race: Blue Storm, is a sequel in name only. It is (in my opinion) fucking awful!

The final insult came with The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess, delivered in the last days of the GameCube (and coming with the feeling that Nintendo were begrudgingly forced into making it).
I distinctly remember walking into Virgin to buy it and being faced with two displays of the game.
The GameCube edition and the Wii edition. The Wii display proudly advertised: The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess . Widescreen - only on Nintendo Wii . . . . .

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And that, as they say, was the end of that.
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Re: GameCube

Post by mycophobia »

Jonny2x4 wrote:REX Hangar, the last area in the game before the final series of battles with Liquid Snake, has a pair of hot and cold pipes that helps you change the temperature of the PAL key without having to backtrack to previous areas. I thought it was pretty nifty design.
whaaaat?? not that backtracking was all that hard but damn
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