Cuphead, new run'n'gun with old-timey art

[mamboFoxtrot]

Finally released!
I wonder what the chances are of my toaster running this well enough. I've generally had bad luck with Unity games, performance-wise.

[soprano1]

GOG also has it. Let's see how this goes.

[LichbannMejolaro]

Finally released!
I wonder what the chances are of my toaster running this well enough. I've generally had bad luck with Unity games, performance-wise.

I'm pretty surprised at how well it runs. I play it on a laptop with a 840M and it's perfect.

Not a single bit of slowdown, even in the most busy parts, with lots of enemies and particles on screen.

And as for the game itself, I'm really surprised. In general, games that are delayed so much end up underperforming, but so far I faced around 10 bosses and it has everything I wanted: It's hard, challenging and unforgiving.

[cave hermit]

I was very skeptical about this game since it was first announced, but I'm pleasantly surprised to see it actually turned out quite well. Game runs ultra smooth, difficulty seems pretty balanced, challenging but not too frustrating, and the developers seem to really understand how to design boss patterns well.

I had some issues actually getting the game to properly recognize a controller though (tried both a pokken tournament controller and a 360 fightstick), with the game seemingly attempting to use both keyboard and gamepad controls at the same time, removing button prompts in game (for example, making it impossible to actually enter the tutorial level after starting a new save) and for some reason causing the little area right before the tutorial level to drop to 10-20 fps. Solution ended up being to use the steam client to register a controller as a steam controller.

[DoomsDave]

Yeah it's not a masterpiece of anything but I can admit when I'm wrong and this game turned out pretty great. I'm a couple hours in and have enjoyed my time so far.

[soprano1]

The soundtrack and animation is really good. Gameplay isn't extraordinary, but it hasn't been a walk in the park either. The controls are kind iffy to configure on my dualshock2 with usb adapter, but other people have been complaining too, so i guess there will be a future patch for it.

[iconoclast]

I didn't plan on buying this, but I got a bunch of free money from an amazon promo earlier, so I figured why not. It's actually really good. I'll enjoy S-ranking everything.

[Udderdude]

The soundtrack and animation is really good. Gameplay isn't extraordinary, but it hasn't been a walk in the park either. The controls are kind iffy to configure on my dualshock2 with usb adapter, but other people have been complaining too, so i guess there will be a future patch for it.

I had to use an Xbox 360 controller, my PS3 Gempad absolutely would not work .. I couldn't even talk to people or select stages to enter.

I also turned off the music. Go ahead, call me a philistine.

[soprano1]

The soundtrack and animation is really good. Gameplay isn't extraordinary, but it hasn't been a walk in the park either. The controls are kind iffy to configure on my dualshock2 with usb adapter, but other people have been complaining too, so i guess there will be a future patch for it.

I had to use an Xbox 360 controller, my PS3 Gempad EX absolutely would not work .. I couldn't even talk to people or select stages to enter.

I also turned off the music. Go ahead, call me a philistine.

You philistine!
But why? Distracting?

[Udderdude]

The soundtrack and animation is really good. Gameplay isn't extraordinary, but it hasn't been a walk in the park either. The controls are kind iffy to configure on my dualshock2 with usb adapter, but other people have been complaining too, so i guess there will be a future patch for it.

I had to use an Xbox 360 controller, my PS3 Gempad EX absolutely would not work .. I couldn't even talk to people or select stages to enter.

I also turned off the music. Go ahead, call me a philistine. :lol:

You philistine! :wink:
But why? Distracting?

Didn't really like it. I just play my own music in the background (I have plenty of Jazz I actually like instead).

[soprano1]

Didn't really like it. I just play my own music in the background (I have plenty of Jazz I actually like instead).

Shame, it's pretty good.

[evil_ash_xero]

Way more bosses than I was expecting.

I read there are only 6 run n' gun stages. Is that the case?

[iconoclast]

S-ranked everything. I guess I'll clean up whatever achievements I'm missing before finishing up.

Negatives:
- Foreground art sometimes obscures your vision. Maybe it's intentional, but I can't think of many good 2D action games where this sticks out as a problem.
- Weapon/item balance isn't great. The charge shot is clearly the best weapon, and everything else is pretty situational. I guess there's also an exploit straight out of Contra 3 where quickly switching between two weapons does more damage, but that sounds annoying so I never tried it.
- Maybe it's a bit short? I'm happy with what's in the game, but I hope they'll add a DLC island or two.
- The default keybindings are terrible. I recommend putting fire on RT and dash on LT.
- The Windows 10 version randomly stops saving progress (and it crashed a few times). Play it anywhere else instead.

Aside from all that I really enjoyed it. Pretty much all of the bosses are fun, and it helps that this is (easily) one of the best looking 2D games ever. I'll probably have it in my top 10 for the year.

I read there are only 6 run n' gun stages. Is that the case?

Sounds about right. They're okay, but I'd trade them for more bosses if I could.

[Sumez]

Is it possible to make the "Windows 10" version work in Windows 8?

[iconoclast]

I think you can just buy it on Steam or GOG. I only bought it from the Windows store because I got some free Xbox credit, and that version works on Xbone & Windows 10.

[Sumez]

I was thinking GOG of course, I actually thought that's what people meant by the "Windows 10" version. Just unsure if my computer will be able to run it. :\ I heard it's a Unity game, which is a bummer for redundant performance overhead.

[chum]

It's really good actually, but I can see a problem with replayability. The only thing left to do if you've done all S rank would be to speedrun I guess and with 80% of the game being boss fights, I don't see speed strats being all that entertaining in this game. It's easily worth experiencing in any case. The bosses have a real wow factor starting from the 2nd world. Breathtaking animation true to its roots. Gameplay is really good for the genre too when it comes to bosses, stages are a bit lacking, but I loved that toy stage with the metal storm gravitation gimmick. Shmups bosses a bit worse, they have inertia.

[LichbannMejolaro]

It's really good actually, but I can see a problem with replayability. The only thing left to do if you've done all S rank would be to speedrun I guess and with 80% of the game being boss fights, I don't see speed strats being all that entertaining in this game. It's easily worth experiencing in any case. The bosses have a real wow factor starting from the 2nd world. Breathtaking animation true to its roots. Gameplay is really good for the genre too when it comes to bosses, stages are a bit lacking, but I loved that toy stage with the metal storm gravitation gimmick. Shmups bosses a bit worse, they have inertia.

You talked about replayability and for me the speedruns would keep this game alive for a long time.

The problem is that the weapon switching glitch (you keep changing weapons during the whole fight, which allows you to fire with 2 guns at the same time) is extremely bad because it DESTROYS your hand, since you have to keep mashing the switch weapon button for 40 minutes.

And the thing is, using this is much faster than the "regular" speedrunning strats. The WR right now (using the glitch) is at 32 minutes, while the non glitch best time is at 37. Is a lot of time and I'm certain that new runners will get disencouraged to play it with the current conditions.

Unless the moderators for the leaderboards creates different categories for the glitches, I can see the game slowly dying in terms of speedrunning.

[Udderdude]

It seems they're interested in continuing development on the game, so I doubt they'll leave bugs like that unpatched.

[LichbannMejolaro]

It seems they're interested in continuing development on the game, so I doubt they'll leave bugs like that unpatched.

I don't know...since this is not a gamebreaking but and that the average joe will never even know about it, I can see they leaving this as it is.

[Sir Ilpalazzo]

The developers have said (on NeoGAF) that they intend on nerfing the charge shot and weapon switching thing.

[Austin]

Huh.. Why nerf the charge shot? Personally I'd rather see other weapons simply be made more useful instead.

Actually, maybe that would just break the game in other ways instead.

[Obscura]

The problem is that the weapon switching glitch (you keep changing weapons during the whole fight, which allows you to fire with 2 guns at the same time) is extremely bad because it DESTROYS your hand, since you have to keep mashing the switch weapon button for 40 minutes.

I haven't played the game, but given that they bragged all about how they had played and understood all of the run 'n gun greats, and the exact same bug is present in possibly the most popular game in the genre, Contra 3, I have no idea how the hell this bug could slip in there unless they were just totally lying about their level of experience with the genre.

[Sumez]

Gee I wonder

[mycophobia]

The problem is that the weapon switching glitch (you keep changing weapons during the whole fight, which allows you to fire with 2 guns at the same time) is extremely bad because it DESTROYS your hand, since you have to keep mashing the switch weapon button for 40 minutes.

I haven't played the game, but given that they bragged all about how they had played and understood all of the run 'n gun greats, and the exact same bug is present in possibly the most popular game in the genre, Contra 3, I have no idea how the hell this bug could slip in there unless they were just totally lying about their level of experience with the genre.

maybe they were paying it homage

[Obscura]

The problem is that the weapon switching glitch (you keep changing weapons during the whole fight, which allows you to fire with 2 guns at the same time) is extremely bad because it DESTROYS your hand, since you have to keep mashing the switch weapon button for 40 minutes.

I haven't played the game, but given that they bragged all about how they had played and understood all of the run 'n gun greats, and the exact same bug is present in possibly the most popular game in the genre, Contra 3, I have no idea how the hell this bug could slip in there unless they were just totally lying about their level of experience with the genre.

maybe they were paying it homage

If it was intentional, I doubt they'd be patching it out.

It seems more like the "we really love these games, we're not just doing it to ride the indie wave, promise!" mask has slipped a bunch.

[ZacharyB]

Not everyone who loves video games does so by checking relentlessly for exploits. Switching back and forth rapidly between a weapon isn't something most people would even think to begin doing, or else it wouldn't be a bug in the first place.

[jepjepjep]

S-ranked everything. I guess I'll clean up whatever achievements I'm missing before finishing up.

Nice vids, iconoclast. You really make the game look easy!

I'm having a lot of fun with this game. The art and animation are amazing, and the game mechanics are surprisingly good too.

[BIL]

Another "not played" here (I've been amused by the chimp rage this game seems to provoke from reviewers however! Wahhh! >:3 ).

I could see the devs being reasonably familiar with Contra III and the genre as a whole, attempting to emulate its weapon toggling, and inadvertently creating exactly the same exploit. Contra III lets you toggle weapons instantaneously and without cancelling any onscreen projectiles. Toggling also resets the firing interval, which is why you can empty both guns quicker by feathering the switch button than exhausting them consecutively. This is how you rack up damage obscenely quick with C+C... if you can deal with all the drawbacks that pairing entails and know how to handle bosses aggressively. Anyone expecting an instant game-solving bullet from this setup is going to get skullfucked hard, lose a gun and retreat to something more balanced. Of the remaining weapon setups, most benefit only mildly from the exploit as a "dead man's click" workaround, and quite a few are outright jammed up by it (F+anything).

This is why I'm never surprised to find myself explaining how C+C works to even adept (Normal clearing) players. Or being accused of "CHEETZ LMAO, NICE TRY NUB" by random Youtube scrubs. Obvious workarounds in CIII's case (I have no idea how Cuphead compares) would be toggle delay, onscreen projectile cancel, and persistent firing intervals. All of these would create at least some friction in the game's handling, however.

So yeah, I could see this being an honest mistake from an enthusiast developer trying to emulate the feel of a genre favourite.

[TransatlanticFoe]

It's a bit disappointing to learn there are so few stages and it's almost entirely boss fights. I watched a video for the first run and gun stage - looked mundane and didn't end with a boss. Are they all like that?

Also do I spy regenerating health? Is there at least an arcade mode where you get a classic stage/boss cycle and no health regen?