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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 11:17 am 


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Volteccer_Jack wrote:
Marc wrote:
I love the game, but it's too much for me to wrap my head around. I'm already panicking on level 3, and the rare occasion I make it to 4... yeah. :D

I'm just now getting comfortable with stage 3, myself. And hey, if I can do it...it doesn't mean anything because I'm better than everyone else

I feel like I have stage 3 down to a science now. In theory anyway, the actual down-in-the-dirt execution is still tense/stressful and may always be. First half of the stage Kusarigama, it's a strong anti-rifle tool for reasons BIL laid out, spin-attacks clear out the leaping zakos. Top priority is avoiding bullets but right below that is positioning properly to jump cleanly over Ghost, he will probably die if I have both clones but I really don't care, in fact ideally he will live to prevent respawn.

As soon as I see the marshland, switch to Sword, avoiding monk staff throws is the toppest of top priorities. Sometimes it's best to stop slashing for a moment here, as hitting their staff will cause it to return immediately, which I don't want--I want the throw to last as long as possible so the monk is out of the fight for longer. Going for any powerups here is a suicide mission, if it's not directly on the path I would have taken anyway then I ignore it. My whole strat for the boss is "have POW grenade and don't get shot by the riflemen."

For 4-1, I've had best success with Kusarigama, as it can deflect the enemy kusarigamas. Ryuchi is formidable, my "preferred" scenario is to leap cleanly over and past his slash arc and then finish him off as I'm landing. It's tricky tho, the last part of the swing that hits behind his head is nasty. Failing that, forcing him to chase you between floor and ceiling is effective, although very dangerous in the vicinity of Purples.

4-2...I dunno yet lol. It's mostly easy except for one part where you have to cross a good-sized stretch of ceiling; if a Ryuichi shows up at the wrong time you're pretty well stuck, since the jump button drops you onto spikes and you can't outmaneuver Ryuchi without jumps. Best solution I can see at the moment is to try to ensure before committing that you can cross safely.

Stage 4 boss is my wall for now, seems to be 'aimed' similar to stage 2 boss, but I haven't worked out a good reliable avoidance strat. Grenade seems like overwhelmingly the best weapon for this boss unless I'm missing something.

Brief glimpse of stage 5, not terribly tough so far? Really reminding me how wonky mid-air control is tho lol.


Vanguard wrote:
Stage 3's marshland definitely feels like the point where the game gets serious. Never did find a good solution to those monks. Interesting that you'd favor the kusarigama in 4-1. No projectiles and lots of samurai mean bombs and shuriken are the only options for me. Stage 5 isn't hard exactly but it's pretty annoying if you don't have a path memorized. A slow, observant approach is a sure win but it isn't fun. It's got nothing on the end of 7, of course.


Round 5 is like a junior version of Round 7 - a memoriser sequence that loses 90% of its sting once you've nailed a route down. Not to sound down on it - it's over in ~30seconds, it lets me enjoy the rocketing max-height jump, and snatching the Shield from a nest of Reds is a fun heist. Also, the boss speedkill is a joyful uproar of grainy, crunchy SPLOSION Image

Oh nooo! *BLAOWOWOWWW*
Spoiler: show
Image


He shoulda kept his day job as Image Fight's second boss! :cool: This here NINJA COUNTRY Image

Round 4-1 is particularly idiosyncratic, with its RNG setups and improv focus. I strongly recommend Grenades, simply because no matter what hand you're dealt, or how you respond, they're best at flipping the table outright. Quicker than Kusarigama, and easier to connect than Shuriken. The only downside is splash blindness, gotta rein it in:

Why u DIRTY MUHFUCKA (■`W´■)
Spoiler: show
Image


The key to 4-2's ceiling crossings is controlled aggression. Get all your guys on the ceiling, and you're actually pretty unassailable. Charging Ryuichis can't make it more than a couple steps into a wall of x3 POW Shuriken/Grenades (I favour the former at Max Rank, the latter at Mid). Pursuing Brown Katanas will get annihilated by the Shadows, and Black Katanas can't hit a stationary player. While I like to use the ground - particularly with Grenades, as their lower stopping power is offset by forcing Ryuichis to jump, plus it lets me splash the ceilings to cull zako - it's by no means impossible to stay up top from start to finish.

What this requires is... Image
Tactical Espionage Action Image

Ceiling Team wa MUTEKI DA (■`W´■)
Spoiler: show
Image


If you get a knack for spoofing Blacks - just stay still - you can aggressively cancel them out of their whiffed stab flurries with a quick about-face, good when you want to aggressively gain ground. They (and Browns!) also can't hit a running player - it's creeping forward that'll get you stabbed. Either/or is the trick: stay still, or advance.

The only risk here is a Ryuichi leaping onto the ceiling from directly underneath you - but as long as you're alert, they shouldn't be able to without losing 95% HP on their way up. The spikes can camouflage them nastily, pay close attention there.

You actually can dodge their slash at overlap range, by moving into and through their X-axis with precise timing as they board, then killing them during the whiff - but this is a fairly pants-shitting maneuver, not to be invited! Image

The Bomb found after the long ceiling crossing is one of two I like to grab (the other is at the very end of 6-2). You can surf its blast wave into and through the final stretch, at which point it's just the trapdoor to deal with. I'm having a bastard of a time elucidating how I deal with those, but TLDR: they don't worry me much. Ryuichi has a pitifully hard time hitting stairbound players before they blow him up with a flurry of Shuriken/Grenades.

Image

Round 4 Boss/"TEH ACCURSED STONES" is very random, and also deceptively fast. On PCB and accurate emulation, x3 POW Grenades (the absolute best choice - their splash is invaluable here) will cause hella slowdown. Don't be fooled, their speed beats Tsukikage's run (though not his jump ascent or ceiling drop, making these valuable emergency escapes). The slowdown is more helpful than harmful, but don't let it lull you into complacency around them. If one gets close, you need to pre-emptively move away from it - by the time you've confirmed whether it's gonna pass by, or actively stomp/wall-splat you, it may be too late.

Their weakness is that only one can move at a time - they can't actively pincer you. Once one is moving, that's the only one you need to actively evade.

And while there's a lot of RNG here, the fight always starts the same way: in your favour. Nail 'em with Grenades as they come skidding down, and wait. Whichever charges at you, take a long jump into its former corner. Now you're on the opposite side of the room, and the next attacker has a long, inefficient journey to make. Alternating between the middle (trade places with the attacker) and sides (next attacker can be seen coming a mile off) is my general tack. Mid Rank has a much easier time here, they'll die after only a few reps. Max Rank has to contend with more RNG, though as shown above, the principle holds no matter how long they last.

Beware rodeo tactics. While it's fun to go for a ride, it invites a very silly, and very deadly glitch. Basically, it's not being "crushed" that kills, but the blue "photocopier beam," which fires whenever the stones make contact with a wall, a ceiling, or more haphazardly, each other. As shown, even if you're well in the clear, if it touches you you're dead. :wink:
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[THE MIRAGE OF MIND] Metal Black ST [THE MASSACRE] Gun.Smoke ST [TRAGEDY FLAME]


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Wed Jan 13, 2021 10:38 pm 


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FYI: Cyber Shadow releases on January 26th. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_VtT9JS-8F4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eMGNvioM0fI

Seems like it's coming to every major platform. PS4, Xbox, Switch, PC.


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 12:38 am 


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Good-looking game. Haven't really looked into it further, but it instantly registers that KoNatsume Compact Action Man™ styling.

Arf Arf! Accidental Rank75% run. Cocked up Round 5, again! Accidentally fell through a ledge right onto a POW. Gee thanks asshole! Image Oh well. Pretty marginal tbh.

This is the first run where I feel like I really motherfucked Boney-sama, who I'm tempted to refer to as Boney-kun, but won't. Went right in with the upshotted bunnyhop to the left, landed a mid-high volley, then the max-height wall drop. And here is why I feel like I done 'im wrong. :oops: Bolt RNG was comically enraged, solid wall of crackling green shite, much angry electrical sounds! Cue the pants-shitting escape to the right which is gradually becoming my trademark, and an aggressive mid-height execution. Pretty sure even at Rank100 I could've taken him out here, though it'd have been awfully close. Image

I'm trying to gradually chip away the "split-second error? inescapably motherfucked" element. I dunno if you really can. :oops: But I do know Rank50 takes a lot of edge off. Image If you're willing to gamble, you can get away with some pretty cocky stuff, like forming a "V" of mid-height barrages either side of Boney. It doesn't help that the bolts' patchy movement makes it tough to detect angry ones until it's too late... if you get one, or more, and you've not taken swift evasive action, the good times end pretty quick.

Boney-sama. He's an asshole!

Messed about with Grenade-only run in tonight's session, quickly went "FUCK this shit" :shock: :lol: But kept on with POW Grenades and regular everything else. As expected, big enemies and bosses die a half-second faster, but I got killed by a kunai and a Wolf in stage 6 consecutively and said fuck it for real. Losing POW Kusarigama ain't worth it, and Saigo doesn't need help killing me.

NAZO DU JOUR (■`ω´■) Is there a "cooldown" between enemy spawns of a single type? I do wonder. Got fairly ghastly Monk/Ryuichi teamups in this evening's credits, but reviewing footage, and thinking back, I can't seem to find instances of two of either spawning less than a second apart. Certain enemies clearly respawn more frequently than others - compare Ghost to Rifle. I wonder if this too is a thing.

Thing I am pretty sure tho (■`ω´■) Was wondering while writing the Rank section of my guide, whether it affects more than large enemy/Boss HP. I don't think it does. Got absolute nonstop motherfuck 6-1 RNG tonight and last night at Rank50. Image

BIL (THATS ME MUHFUCKA (■`W´■) ) wrote:


Goddamn, I'd forgotten what a killer tune KARAKURI (Mechanism)'s second half is. The sleepy first half has a mood too, apropos to a mysterious trap-loaded manor, but I suspect Masahiko Ishida intended the intensity to dial up when you hit Spikey Deathtrap Basement, and most definitely Crushing Ceiling Sub-Basement. I let it play through in my beta PC Engine Super CD ver. :cool: Headphones Warning! I am not good @ mixing desk. :oops: (considered replacing the weak HuCard SFX, I hate how they chirp through... I wonder if that'd be possible on an actual CD version?)

See also the awesome pummelling death drums of KIZAISHI (Omen)'s second half, which you won't hear in-game unless, like this madman, you wait around at the diving board. And even then, the regular boss theme KESSEN (Duel) will take over at Boney. Crumbs!

Apparently Ishida forgot to include the rest of R-Type II's fourth stage BGM, which is why it just lingers on those blaring power chords. I'd never have guessed something was amiss tbh, you can't exactly stop and smell the sine waves in that meatgrinder of a game. I bet these guys were working their asses off. Image

Image
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There ain't half been some clever bastards
[THE MIRAGE OF MIND] Metal Black ST [THE MASSACRE] Gun.Smoke ST [TRAGEDY FLAME]


Last edited by BIL on Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:29 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 4:47 am 


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BIL wrote:
Apparently Ishida forgot to include the rest of R-Type II's fourth stage BGM, which is why it just lingers on those blaring power chords. I'd never have guessed something was amiss tbh, you can't exactly stop and smell the sine waves in that meatgrinder of a game. I bet these guys were working their asses off.

I always wondered why the R-Type II ending held on that one note forever, that's pretty funny that they just left in a mistake on purpose. Should've faded out or something though, it's definitely a bit awkward sounding :lol:
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 5:21 am 


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Definite air of rock n' roll chaos in that interview, with the guy hanging on to the end of '89 cranking out killer OSTs and looping Image Fight, before the urge to get back onstage and RAWK finally became too strong. :mrgreen:

Shmuplations wrote:
mysterious, nihilistic sound!
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 6:11 am 


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Irem were rock stars back in those days. It still cracks me up that they named their NES game after a heavy metal song.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EhGEGIBGLu8

I've gotta get back to my 1LC challenge in Saigo. I've come close a few times.


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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 8:31 am 


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Some dodgy-looking AA side scroller out on the JPN eShop last night. Not a clue what it is, but side-scrollers on avert screen are usually a pain in the ass.
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 Post subject: Re: Ninja Gaiden [NES] + R2RKMF: Scrolling Action Monogatari
PostPosted: Thu Jan 14, 2021 10:56 pm 


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jepjepjep wrote:
Irem were rock stars back in those days. It still cracks me up that they named their NES game after a heavy metal song.


Ishida did that one's OST too. Image Shame about the crummy command interpreter though! :evil: Peep these character/enemy names, Guilty Gear wishes it was as hardcore. :cool:

Incidentally, the MSX Gradius/Salamander guys were rocking out too. Sounds like they'd be good chaps for an evening of fine listening and fine shumping alike. Image

Image

Geezer did by all accounts like to blaze it!

Marc wrote:
Some dodgy-looking AA side scroller out on the JPN eShop last night. Not a clue what it is, but side-scrollers on avert screen are usually a pain in the ass.


That's Nichibutsu's Cosmo Police Galivan, making its Switch debut some years behind the PS4 version. TBH, as soon as I saw it had [Up To Jump] and tied it to aiming upward, I ran away screaming. :wink: I searched around the forum a bit, in case I'd missed something... seems a reasonably well-regarded game on here. Watched Janet's customarily skillful 1CC, didn't feel much inspiration tbh. As tends to happen with Nichibutsu, I'm left wondering if I'm just missing something.

Their topdown run/gun Holy Warrior Amaterasu / Soldier Girl Amazon has some interesting ideas, namely high-speed vehicle hijacking. Hop in a monster tank and run those bastards down! Unfortunately, it has a bit of AC Contra/Jackal-style aim lag, never an easy sell. I'm hoping their Ninja Emaki shows up at some point. Never actually played it, I just adore that oldschool Kamui ninja manga aesthetic (shared by Saigo). Speaking of Saigo:

WASSHOI (■`W´■)

Image

This week's Sakusen: BONEY MUST DIE has gone alright, I think I have a pattern down. Calling it a night tomorrow, we'll see if Rabbit Fist Dojo can hold out against their bitter rivals Strong Bones School.
Rival Schools United By Fate Image Image Image

For now, I am here with an important PSA! Not only is Saigo's arcade instruction art nowhere as nice as its IREM M72 stablemate Hero Tonma's - it's also quite misleading! Image

Spoiler: show
Image


You do not need to rotate the stick/pad to get the POW Kusarigama swing - let alone so vigorously that steam is emitted from the controller housing! Even the tiniest directional adjustment during the initial attack will get you the whole swing every time! Holding [forward]? Tap [UF] or [UD]. Holding [down]? Tap [DL] or [DR]. Etc etc!

You can use cardinals too, that's what I like to do when the pad's in neutral, eg hop forward, neutral attack, tap [up] - whoa! SPINNEH-MAH-WINNEH is wiping out those lousy ZAKOTEKI not just left and right, but up and down and all around, too! Image
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