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 Post subject: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:50 pm 


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http://www.timeanddate.com/countdown/ge ... +end&swk=1

Nemesis romset Nemesis

you can start doing scores for this one round 1 has 10 mins left
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:40 am 


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Jaimers - 320,600 - 2-1
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:50 am 


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Nice first showing Jaimers! That'll give us all something to shoot for.

I guess my 20 year feud with this game's Moai stage is going to come to a violent and bloody end once and for all this week. This tournament should give me all the motivation I need :twisted:
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 2:41 am 


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Edit: Better score 8)
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:37 am 


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Edge - 405,400 - 1-7 - gentleman - scorpio

Sorry, I post a screenshot for the next score. That's the fist score, so there will be more to come anyway. Somehow he didn't save a screenshot, although I was pretty sure i made one... :/


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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:00 am 



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Is there any particular reason why this and not Gradius? Are they any different?
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 9:39 am 


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God I hate this game, it's been my mortal enemy since I was like 7 years old. Anyone care to tell me a consistent way to not get wasted by the stage two cube rush?

EDIT: Figured it out, go to the center far right edge of the screen trailing your options behind you when you have the laser and sit still. Nothing will touch you.

Here's my first score, the farthest I've ever been in Gradius:

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Erppo wrote:
Is there any particular reason why this and not Gradius? Are they any different?


I think it has to do with recovery, when you respawn there are always a ton of red ships that pop up to aid your recovery, which I'm pretty sure don't exist in the Japanese version. I managed to recover in the Moai stage, and that's saying a lot.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:17 am 


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An improvement:

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I can't realistically see myself getting a godly high score at this game, but I'll be very happy if I can at least clear it.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 1:40 pm 


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my original game list had nemesis instand of gradius and i chose nemesis but difference i am not sure it might be only what ACSeraph said
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 6:12 pm 


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RetroUprising's game list has Nemesis rather than Gradius, so I think it is due in part to that.


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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 7:44 pm 



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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:00 pm 


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Kollision - 222,000 - 1-5

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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Tue Jan 14, 2014 11:16 pm 



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Erppo - 414,800 - 2-1

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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 8:50 am 


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Please allow me to vent a bit here, seriously I fucking hate this game so much. It's just so incredibly unfairly designed, and I just don't have the Gandhi-like levels of patience to clear it I don't think. I just cannot for the life of me find a strategy that works for the final stage. The game is clearly 100% memorization, even more so than Salamander. There's just no way to dodge half the stuff in it if you aren't in the proper position way ahead of time and nothing about the actual strategies required feels intuitive. For all it's sloppiness I could see the logic behind how Salamander was approached, but I'm not seeing any of that here.

Does anyone seriously think this is a good game? Or do we all just respect it because it was impressive for it's time?

Tips would be very welcomed. Help me see what I'm missing here.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:30 am 


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I feel basically the opposite of you, heh. I think Salamander is a horrible fucking game and Gradius is significantly better.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:43 am 


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I liked it a lot more before I started to attempt to 1cc it. Salamander is... inoffensive to me. Life Force is an improvement. It's like, I recognize that Gradius is better, but I despise it because of it's utter cheapness.

I haven't figured out any sort of consistent strategy for it yet, but I have been able to clear the final stage in state practice twice now. However thats twice out of god knows how many attempts. It's the first half in particular that I find unbearable. I did figure this out:

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If you have options you can just sit in this exact spot without moving all the way through the section.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 10:12 am 


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Well I 1-all'd Gradius in like a few hours without looking at a replay so it can't really be 100% memo.
If you are stuck in a part, in these games the answer is almost always to play with the options. Enemies also always shoot a bullet a you when they are about to leave the screen so that is useful to remember.

Salamander is objectively way worse though. That game had sections all over the game where you could just sit in one spot and literally close your eyes for 20 seconds. Gradius at least keeps you engaged in that you have to actually pay attention and not fall asleep.
Dying once also doesn't lead to an instant game over and there are almost no cheap shots unlike Salamander.
Stage 5 and 6 are garbage though.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 10:21 am 


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Jaimers wrote:
Well I 1-all'd Gradius in like a few hours without looking at a replay so it can't really be 100% memo.


I honestly think you're on a way different level than me (and probably most other people) at these games.

What is your strategy for the first portion of Stage 7 after entering the base?
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 10:38 am 


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Haha maybe.

If you have three speedups and four options you can play with the options to form these "side cannons" on your ship that take care of all the walking ceiling and floor turrets before they enter the screen.
That should take you almost all the way through the stage although you do have to go out your way to kill some other enemies.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 11:03 am 


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I had no idea your speed affected how the options behave. I always kept it at speed two because 3 felt unwieldy to me. I've been trying it out here but I can't really get down what you are describing. You mean to spread the options above and below you? I don't see how that can help you much with those mounted turrets firing constant unending streams of bullets at you. Those turrets are probly the biggest things bothering me in the entire game, I think they are pretty bullshit in stage two also.

I guess without seeing it I can't really get what you are saying :(
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 12:49 pm 


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ACSeraph wrote:
The game is clearly 100% memorization, even more so than Salamander.


I strongly disagree with this. I have never used any save state or watched replays for this game. I also don't have any fixed routes or positions I need to stay in. This game can be played intuitively flying around and reacting to the stuff, while you see it... most of the time. Ok, there are a few weird spots in the game and the volcano in stage 1 is also bullshit if you don't know it. But the few cheap shots in this game are on a whole different level than Salamander's fest of random deaths.

The weird colision detection and the enemies shooting at you while leaving the screen are the biggest offenders for me in this game. IMHO it is a true classic and still almost 30 years later fun to play.


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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 1:41 pm 


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This game has a whole host of weird cheap shit if you ask me. The turrets are probably the biggest offenders because they shoot so quickly you literally can't dodge with your big-ass hitbox. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying Salamander is a better game, but it sure didn't cause me to rage as much as this one does. I really don't see how you guys are dealing with stages 2, 3, and 7 by just "winging it". Maybe I just suck :| Anyhow I'll keep working at it. No progress tonight except a vague plan for stage 7.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 2:14 pm 


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ACSeraph wrote:
I really don't see how you guys are dealing with stages 2, 3, and 7 by just "winging it". Maybe I just suck :|


Well, it is played a bit differently than modern shmups. So, maybe you are just not used to this kind of playstyle. I can see how this can be frustrating, if one is not used to dodge bullets with a big ass hitbox. :)

EDIT:
There is not a lot of micro dodging in this game. Usually you should make sure to utilize your options. Which can often be done on the fly, like in stage 3. When you see the fruity loops incoming you can just position yourself, so that your options will protect you. Also consider using double for stages with lots of enemies on the ceiling. And on constant enemy fire, try to move around to create gaps in their fire, before they trap you.


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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 5:08 pm 



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A bit less bad.

Erppo - 500,200 - 2-2

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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 6:37 pm 


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Eaglet - 226,400 - Stage 6 (?) (does the thingy in space with the puffy pink tentacle clouds count as an actual stage?)

First real credit. A lot more fun than i thought it would be.
Recovery made easy makes for a much less frustrating experience.

Definitely agree that this is much less memo heavy than Salamander. Hitbox also seems waaaay tinier!
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:06 pm 



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ONE LAST THING: WE NOW HAVE 27 TEAMS AND SIGNING UP AS A NEW CONTESTANT IS NO LONGER POSSIBLE !!


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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:46 pm 


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So after an hour I can state with confidence that were I locked in a room for eternity and only allowed one game i would never in good conscience pick Salamander over this game.

Before this tourney I'd never played either game, its pretty fascinating to compare the two.
In the first minute of Gradius its already giving you a bunch of options (excuse the pun) of how to approach the stage and the action is thick and fast. In comparison the beginning of salamander is dull by the 4th coin.
Also the music is wonderful, makes me feel like I'm playing a cute'em up. I turned off the music in Salamander within about ten minutes I think.
In any other genre enemies spawning on me and being killed by pixel fragments would have had me rolling on the floor with laughter, but Salamander drove me up the wall. Luck seemed to outweigh practice in that game.

Maybe because there are more aimed shots in this (correct me if I'm wrong) , it becomes less about memorization and more about winging it with your preferred option layout.

Does anyone know what affects rank? I believe in Gradius it was having more than one option. In Nemesis, it seems to be affected by speed and whether you use the shield power up.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:52 pm 


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I think rank is affected by anything you power up with. Options and shield being the biggest increases.
It's kind of ridiculous seeing the difference in bullet speed when you haven't powered up at all and with a full blown arsenal.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 7:58 pm 


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Took about four good hours to get this far...phew, I'll keep trying.
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 Post subject: Re: round 2 nemesis
PostPosted: Wed Jan 15, 2014 9:07 pm 


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66,600 1-3 JWS

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Two hours play. Good or bad?
Love the sharing spirit going on in this comp.
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