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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Sat Feb 13, 2016 7:01 pm 


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Joined: 21 Apr 2015
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Location: Paris
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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 4:38 pm 


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wow, I just only found out about Pazzy's run!! Who are you Pazzy where are you from? You did this from November-August?? What did you play before??

This is amazing it's a no miss no bomb of the whole game before TLB, game which is definitely harder than BL as far as I know, with highly optimized score as well and a bug that took him these extra pro points he should have!! (so unfair!!)

edit: ah he did use 2 bombs on 2-2 boss, I recognized this boss as having problematic ultra violent randomness as something that detered me to play WL at one point. It's too bad we're kinda split between two very close games, WL is still very good obviously and harder which is always nice so long as its fair, which WL is almost not but still a bit!! lol
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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Sat Feb 27, 2016 5:51 pm 


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Hey Prom, you should watch the right replay, he didn't use any bomb against 2-2 boss on his record run: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxVAI26-IFs

Pazzy's been streaming WL lately by the way : http://www.twitch.tv/pazaizy


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 01, 2016 1:35 am 


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PROMETHEUS wrote:
wow, I just only found out about Pazzy's run!! Who are you Pazzy where are you from? You did this from November-August?? What did you play before??

This is amazing it's a no miss no bomb of the whole game before TLB, game which is definitely harder than BL as far as I know, with highly optimized score as well and a bug that took him these extra pro points he should have!! (so unfair!!)

edit: ah he did use 2 bombs on 2-2 boss, I recognized this boss as having problematic ultra violent randomness as something that detered me to play WL at one point. It's too bad we're kinda split between two very close games, WL is still very good obviously and harder which is always nice so long as its fair, which WL is almost not but still a bit!! lol


Hi Prometheus!

I'm just a relatively new Dutch player who recently decided to be a bit more ambitious with my goals. I started playing WL back in November 2014 and made progress at a decent pace. I already had some experience because I had 2-ALLed Black Label a couple months before I started practicing WL. My first WL 2-ALL was in June 2015 and then a couple months later, in August, I got the run I had been going for. I love setting goals I don't actually see myself getting in my lifetime, and yet, it still happened.

And you've probably noticed already but my latest DOJ video is https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NxVAI26-IFs. This was the NMNB run up to Hachi and it didn't have the chain-glitch. I actually did PB a couple weeks ago, but the score increase was only a measly 2m points because of mistakes I made. At least I full-chained 8 stages in that run which was also one of the things I wanted to do. I still don't consider it worth uploading though.

I consider WL to be a really fair game overall, there's only 1 part which I think is difficult/just badly designed and that is the 2-2 boss. I'm actually really consistent at the 2nd loop so for me it's difficult to find something that I would just call plain unfair. In my latest route I've started using a single bomb on the 2-2 boss, the bomb + some hyper-usage is a really consistent safe strategy to get past the boss.

I'm glad you noticed my videos. You were an inspiration to me when I started playing DOJ!


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Thu Mar 03, 2016 8:19 pm 


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Just watched it! Really cool solid very nice dodges notably some really hard dodges @2-4 second half which can be horrible sometimes eheheh very nice job

It's pretty amazing how fast you got this good, I wonder if you were good already @ some other games before you played DOJ/shmups.

It's true WL is not necessarily that unfair, personally I disliked how it kills your chaining plan because you rely on hypers to chain but if you make a mistake you don't have hypers when you need.. but in the end you can learn to chain most things without hypers.. I didn't play it that much and I was on this PS2 emulator with a bit of input lag so it annoyed me to lose points on other chains when I missed a chain or optimization in a chain. Also the lives removed @end of loop is a laugh, but it doesn't really matter when you're playing for score since you don't want any death.. well. Yes the 2-2 boss is definitely problematic, sometimes it's just nice and hard but many times it's nearly impossible at random, that's not good, ends up being the worst flaw in WL it seems though to be fair must say it's a great game regardless.

It's interesting because I think I may not have seen a max rank second loop of WL before, so I can see how it compares with BL. The behavior of rank in second loop, the few differences in patterns and how it affects them. Someone wrote that in BL, rank increases more slowly, but the cap for rank is higher. I could never check it before. It seems it evens out approx end of 2-4, and 2-5 in BL may be slightly faster at max rank. However, for example, the Hibachi pattern second-to-last seems harder in WL (tighter).

Anyway again rly great job man respect ;; -_-

since you are Dutch, you should come to next Stunfest in Rennes May 20-22 as you're not so far away ;)
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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2016 4:41 pm 



Joined: 05 Mar 2016
Posts: 8
Location: China
descriptive - 441.104.770 - A-E - ALL - 1240 Hits(Shmupmame2.2)

I 'm harduser's friend,Since he had told me the Game rank(He had told me the game has three rank:Hyper rank,Stage rank and Game rank) will be lower by shot down the boss in 1st loop faster,here is his proof
https://mega.nz/#!2kJ1ALYQ!J8at-ii9vGkkpIZ0M8b7zxElJmIxfw_1pcdDwCWGbUo

By the way,he had played the very hard rank(at the cabinet setting) before and he had thought the rank will bring to 2nd loop,so with his opinion,I changed the way to shot down the boss.

Here is my input file(used default nvram of shmupmame2.2)
https://mega.nz/#!Px4yBAbR!i5sfkUsCmWyU6VkNfB_P96EJ4JdsrCd9gdV8wrW-yIg

1-1/1-2:
I used the similar way like 2-1/2-2boss to defeat the 1-1/1-2boss

1-3
At this stage I have a mistake at the second half,so I just used 1hyper&1bomb to deal with the 1st form of 1-3boss,when the boss was changing its form,It's unattackable,so at this time I suicided and used 2 laser bomb to shot down this boss

1-4
As you see, 1Hyper&1bomb&1Hyper can shot down the 1st form more quickly

1-5
This stage I want thank to iconoclast,by his video I found the easier way to face to this stage
"Entia non sunt multiplicanda praeter necessitatem",If I have 3 lives,why not bomb through it to shot down it more quickly?

2-3boss
The third wave of the 1st form can hold laser and move less to handle it(like the inputfile)

The Hyper Gauge of this boss is crucial,Although actually after defeated the mid boss,30%Hyper gauge is enough,I recommend to control the gauge to 75%(started to change white,so at the 2nd form,when the blue bullet was close to you,the hyper can appear and can be used after 240frames force by suicide)

If,unfortunately,when the boss changed to the second form,the hyper gauge isn't enough,you can stand at the right side(not the left)at the boss,and the red bullet has 2 form:

1.Counterclockwise rotation:
You can move from right to left,and then when the bullet shape changed clockwise rotation,you can move from left to right(although the blue bullet is easy,you shouldn't forget it!)

2.Clockwise rotation
The same!move from right to left,and then again!
after about 2times the red bullet changed its shape,you can use the 240frames' force to hold laser to defeat the boss

*Tips:after suicide,you should mention at the shape,when:

1.Counterclockwise rotation:
after suicide,you should stand at the right side to handle it

2.Clockwise rotation:
After suicide,you should stand at the left side to handle it

2-4railgun
I used 2bomb at it(1laser bomb and 1bomb)
the small enemies are fixed,this is very critical,remember this you can handle it more easier

1.The first 3 is easy,but sometime it will be brutal,so when you found it becomes brutal,you should use your hyper!

2.The 4.5 is critical,you should use 1hyper or 1laser bomb when the 4-way blue bullet(or the red bullet) of the railgun are closing to you,1hyper or a laser bomb

3.Again,you should hold until the small enemies appears from the right side to the left side,if this enemies appears,congratulations,the brutal point of 2-4 rail gun is over

After the enemies appears,you should use a bomb(better shot bomb!),and then shot down the 6-8 railgun by the force time(152frames),then the route is fixed,if you want to 1cc it,you 'd better make this part very stable

2-4boss

*Tips:
When the boss changes its 1st form to the 2nd form,you shouldn't stand below the screen,please stand at about 1/2 of the screen(but,mention about the boss,when you stand over the 1/3,the boss can let you miss when your flight hit it!),with that method,you can found the bullet of the 2nd form was easier!

2-5

before the 2nd mid boss,the first part of 2-5 is easy,just remember how to handle it(iconoclast's video I think is perfect,even made me more surprised than pazzy's)

You can use the hyper like me to decrease the diffculty of this game,remember when the 2nd mid boss become brutal,you can have a miss here.

2-5boss

Thanks to the lower game rank,the boss can be easier to shot down

(2laser bomb at the second wave of boss1,but 2bomb should with some dodging of the blue bullet)
Hibachi used the same way like Tame/iconoclast

My target is just get a 2-all of WL,so I didn't care about my score(and at 1-5 I had a serious chain break),but I wish this input file can help more player to defeat the 2nd loop of WL,thanks again to everyone


Last edited by descriptive on Mon May 09, 2016 9:58 am, edited 7 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2016 4:49 pm 



Joined: 05 Mar 2016
Posts: 8
Location: China
Ah,by the way,1cc this horrible game spent me 400hrs on BL and 1400hrs on WL(mainly on A-EX&B-L,but I hadn't 1cc the 2nd loop of BL before,although the WL is harder than BL)
(thanks to harduser or I wouldn't be able to 1cc this game)


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2016 2:23 am 


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Posts: 215
Location: California, USA
Quote:
descriptive - 441.104.770 - A-E - ALL - 1240 Hits(Shmupmame2.2)


Holy :shock: .... Congrats on the ALL!

Quote:
Ah,by the way,1cc this horrible game spent me 400hrs on BL and 1400hrs on WL


Got to love that determination. :)
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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2016 5:02 pm 


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Congrats on the clear, descriptive! It takes serious dedication to tackle this game, but it's worth the effort. Right? :P
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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 09, 2016 6:52 pm 



Joined: 05 Mar 2016
Posts: 8
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Actually I didn't care about my playing time before,but can be more efficient,as we know,pazzy used 500hrs to get 1.64bil,but I take 1400hrs,I think the reason is using the 13.3” laptop to play the WL(I had bought a ps2&the dojwl of ps2 version,but at the LCD,the input lag was horrible to play),using keyboard to decrease the input lag,but if I used the 360 or have a CRT,maybe I can spent far less time


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou (new thread)
PostPosted: Sun Mar 13, 2016 10:10 pm 


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Updated.

Congratulations descriptive!


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Mon Mar 28, 2016 2:44 am 


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The Armchair General - 129,331,750 - A-L - 2-1 - ???

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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Wed Apr 06, 2016 3:20 pm 



Joined: 19 Aug 2014
Posts: 43
Location: Shenzhen,China
Congragulas descriptive,Seemed you are using some better method,Maybe you can get more score in it.

harduser - 612.814.170 - A-S - 2-5 - 1989 Hits(Shmupmame 4.2)

Reached the "Wash Machine".
here is the input:http://www.mediafire.com/download/870do489sdg8qjg/ddpdoj-A-S-ACD-2-5-044%28610M%29.inp
and here is the nvram file(without it,this inp aren't able to play):http://www.mediafire.com/download/oc7mrymkmbqq2ng/sram


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 6:02 am 



Joined: 19 Aug 2014
Posts: 43
Location: Shenzhen,China
Seemed pazzy get 18.4 billion,I think I should practice the 2-5,maybe some time I would get 1bil.


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Fri Apr 08, 2016 4:18 pm 


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Nice WL score and nice BL ALL harduser! Shot types are very hard to use for chaining imo. Have you ever tried to score with Exy?


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Sat Apr 09, 2016 9:18 am 



Joined: 19 Aug 2014
Posts: 43
Location: Shenzhen,China
Feedbacker wrote:
Nice WL score and nice BL ALL harduser! Shot types are very hard to use for chaining imo. Have you ever tried to score with Exy?

To Feedbacker:
Although the Shot Types are hard to getting score(I even dicided to abort the maximum score because It's too hard to shot down hibachi by reaching it with NMNB),but the highest score are also low,the highest score for A-S at WL is only 1.28bil,all,finished by HEY.Maybe the score seemed low but if I use the A-Exy/B-Exy only to get some score seemed higher(such as 700M-1bil),that's boring.

I had tried the A-Exy at the first time,but after 1-all the WL,I finished dicided to use the A-Shootia,the most reason I dicided to use the Shootia is Shootia is harder to getting score,this challenge made me felt very exciting when getting more score.

And another personal reason is I think I can't reach some nice score by using the Exy,so I think Shootia can make me play this game constantly

Maybe someday I can 2-all the WL by using A-Shootia,My target is 1bil by using A-Shootia(Maybe the 1st loop needs 500M and the 2-5 must be full-chained)

BY the way,at niconico video,A player named Hitsuji has finished 800M of 1st loop(WL),Although his 2-4&2-5's score is too low to defeat the 1.28bil of HEY,but there's someway to get much more score than 1.28bil,getting 2.2bil seemed extremely diffcult to Exy,but getting 1.3bil seemed easier to Shootia.

In WL,I had also discoverd how to 1miss the "wash machine" by 1miss the first form of hibachi(but the 2-5boss seem extremely hard,especially the 3rd wave),and all the scoreplay of A-Shootia of WL is 0-0 to all,so there's some space to defeat their score.

In BL,I think maybe someday I can reach 2.0bil by using Shootia,but the Shootia player is so rare so I dicided to play something new.


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Sun Apr 10, 2016 9:46 am 



Joined: 19 Aug 2014
Posts: 43
Location: Shenzhen,China
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Maybe Someday I can really get 1Bil!
Finally I know how to chain the MID-BOSS of 1-3(A-S,WL)


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Sun Apr 10, 2016 5:00 pm 


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Ahah nice! This link is scary in WL.
I'm curious, do you play on keyboard or arcade stick?


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Sun Apr 10, 2016 5:43 pm 



Joined: 19 Aug 2014
Posts: 43
Location: Shenzhen,China
Feedbacker wrote:
Ahah nice! This link is scary in WL.
I'm curious, do you play on keyboard or arcade stick?


Both descriptive&me use the laptop's keyboard.
WY also uses keyboard on his training.

Today Descriptive gives me a state for A-EX to 1miss the "Washing Machine",here is the state(This state is shmupmame2.2's state)
http://www.mediafire.com/download/o880wu1ftj073c6/5.sta

Here is the State's run(first miss on "Washing Machine")
Image
Here is Pazzy's run(first miss on "Washing Machine")
Image

As you see,the Hibachi's HP is exactly the same.

Since I had watched Pazzy's 1.83bil's run,I guess if Pazzy knows the soh's run(hibachi 2miss),and if his last hyper maintains laser,he will be easier to 1miss the hibachi.


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Sun Apr 10, 2016 6:24 pm 


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So many great DOJ players use keyboards!

Pazzy said that he used Fufufu's wasshoi run, SPS live streams and the old Arika DVD as references.
SOH run is on niconico right? Could you please share the link? Looks like only his Death Label run is available on YT.


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Sun Apr 10, 2016 6:59 pm 



Joined: 19 Aug 2014
Posts: 43
Location: Shenzhen,China
Feedbacker wrote:
So many great DOJ players use keyboards!

Pazzy said that he used Fufufu's wasshoi run, SPS live streams and the old Arika DVD as references.
SOH run is on niconico right? Could you please share the link? Looks like only his Death Label run is available on YT.


Yes,this method used on A-E can decreases far more dodging,but for a-e,there's other crucial point.since I saw pazzy's this runhttps://www.twitch.tv/pazaizy/v/21103221
When reaching the "Washing Machine",when the red bullets appears,you shouldn't laser it,the time the blue bullets appears depends on Hibachi's HP.

On that state's run,There's more space of the blue bullets to deal with hibachi to the first time the gauge fulfilled.

Then there's a very crucial point:REMEMBER TO USE THE LAST HYPER WITHOUT ANY SHOT,FULL LASER!WHEN YOU GET THE LAST HYPER,YOU SHOULD IMMEDIATELY HOLD THE LASER AND USE THE HYPER,THEN THE ATTACK IS ENOUGH.

So,that's why not laser the hibachi a while since the red bullets appears,or there's no space of blue bullets WHEN YOU USE THE LAST HYPER BY HOLDING LASER.

here's soh's run but his last hyper has some problem.
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm20355482

He also has a A-L's Hibachi 1miss,but this one is useless.
http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm23981917

Seemed he has deleted his A-L's 2miss run(With the method how to 1miss the "Washing Machine")
The name is "怒首領蜂大往生(白) ―緋蜂2機落とし/3機落としパターン―"

Actually,The waitting time of red bullets of ""Washing Machine"" is different from Arcade/Mame and PS2.


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2016 9:09 am 


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Thanks for the links!

Impoved my PB a little bit, thanks to the 1-5 full chain.

Feedbacker - 490.028.690 - A-E - 2-1 - 2558 Hit
Pic: http://i.imgur.com/uVHigLK.jpg


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Mon Aug 01, 2016 10:37 am 


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Posts: 148
Location: Paris
Feedbacker - 518.640.180 - A-E - 2-1 - 2736 Hit
Pic: http://i.imgur.com/X5ZHXc1.png


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 7:29 pm 


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Posts: 148
Location: Paris
Feedbacker - 302.764.770 - B-E - 1-5 - 2180 Hit
Pic: http://i.imgur.com/iYhlW82.png


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Tue Nov 21, 2017 9:01 am 


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Joined: 21 Apr 2015
Posts: 148
Location: Paris
Feedbacker - 542.845.470 - A-E - 2-2 - 2442 Hit
Pic: https://i.imgur.com/qLDx6A2.png


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 1:58 am 



Joined: 19 Aug 2014
Posts: 43
Location: Shenzhen,China
harduser - 858,835,350 - A-E - ALL - 2426Hits

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Screen recording:https://mega.nz/#!P5xAFbgA!2WOBHYA8NgOBQUy4ZYQi35IKCRdiD8HHkHsVOKqPbHk
AVI:https://mega.nz/#!u5JVAYgD!NALUrDWuKESoJUnmgr18MEZmf5Qj-3S_ViDH9iGee4U
inp(Groovymame 0.171):
https://mega.nz/#!30xBwSZA!J5uqvqgkn3iRr4DcfbVn7JPm6sOOa1EkvteZzUFNXR8

#The Youtube/Bilibili link will be updated serval months later,for I want to write a text "Guide" for it to describe some methods/System,with Chinese&English#

The reason using A-EX instead of A-S:
1.the 1-5&2-5 will be easier to full-chain,so I have lower pressure to bring higher score to an ALL-run.
#The 1-5 had 2 mistakes,one in mid-boss 1,because of using laser to maintain the chain,one in mid-boss 2,because of using the hyper too early

2.I had conbined MON&TAME's method to get a stable way to pass the 2-1boss
with this method I can have a over 20+ succeed run in Practicing,So the success rate is higher than A-S


The mistakes:
1.1-4boss,but still acceptable
2.1-5,lost 200M
3.Washing machine:get the hyper gauge too lot,so the Washing machine had to use 3ships to shoot down,lost 50M-70M


Last nearly success run is a nice run which I brought 3ships to hibachi and at last I met the invincible time's bug,so although the Hibachi's hp is lower than 33180,I still dead,the run's score is about 700+M
this run isn't perfect,but after 7 runs I finally finished it,so the loop2's success rate is nearly 14%,thanks to the succeed in 2-5,I finally get a 800+M's score

#The perfect route will acheive 1.1b,but if I want to get more than 1.1b,I still need to practice the Stage4&Stage5#

The problem of present route:
1.first 3 stage can have a higher score
2.Stage4 didn't get full score
3.Stage1-5 needs to learn 3000+hits method
4.Stage2-4 needs to get bee-perfect


I had send this news(and the message of discord) to descripive at earlier times,but he has been busy with his current job now,and at last,he had gave his ID&password to me :(
If he finally continued,maybe another 1bil player will borned,for I know serval chinese players(one is KAL(in this forum),the other is a player which usually activated on GOTVG) which recently start the DOJWL scoring had acheive about 800+M in loop1(KAL told me he had acheived 810+M in loop1,the other player acheived 790+M in loop1)

At next time I will start to practice 2-1-Start to all 2 consecutive times,or in all twice in 3 times 2-1-Start's run to get a higher success rate
After I finished Stage4's route,when I can get 700+M with A-EX,I will continue to use A-S to practice the 1-3's full-chain,My A-E's Ultimate GOAL is 1.9-2Bil,A-S's Ultimate GOAL is 1.4-1.5Bil


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 8:34 am 


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Joined: 21 Apr 2015
Posts: 148
Location: Paris
Very nice harduser! Congratulations on the clear and the score!
Looking forward to watching the replay/guide of this run.


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 1:02 pm 



Joined: 26 Feb 2016
Posts: 49
Location: Montréal, Canada
:shock: ok that play was really nice.

love the way you expedite boss 2 !

and what a finish! thanks !


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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Mon Mar 19, 2018 4:01 pm 


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Location: Massachusetts
iconoclast - 1,716,695,950 - B-E - 2-ALL - 3109 Hits
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 Post subject: Re: Dodonpachi Dai-Ou-Jou [Arcade/PS2/X360]
PostPosted: Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:50 am 


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RegalSin wrote:
I think I have downloaded so much I am bored with downloading. No really I bored with downloading stuff I might consider moving to Canada or the pacific.

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