Holiday Season Retro Tournament - ROUND 2

[Zerst]

An interesting note is that for some reason, whether or not the powerups you collect show the E icons seems to be dependent on the "Allow Continue" dip switch being on. So this will actually make a (really annoying) difference in gameplay, if you haven't already disabled it.

[Ed Oscuro]

Ed Oscuro - 176,950

Saved a state right before getting killed, but I don't think it was really caused by that, just a random bullet from my 7 o'clock position that would have been hard to notice in time for a dodge anyway. I loaded the state just to see and I only got to 187K so it's not like it broke my run or anything.

FIRST play of the day by the way. Something just clicked for me this time.

Not an impossible game by any stretch of the imagination, I think Erppo and Nimitz have gotten the hang of it.

The Terra Cresta-style unending stage layout makes hidden doodad memorization really hard, and the way of uncovering the 3000 point icons is difficult if you don't have them memorized (I still get a good number of them, but probably not as many as I should, far less than half and less than a quarter in the areas I was first playing). I don't think it matters though - survival scoring and a huge chunk of my score comes from the boss (I noticed a 30K bump over my previous score, over 100K, before the boss was even dead, and you get either 1K or 10K bonus when it dies).

system11 - 71680

I just can't beat that boss.

I WAS going to say "So play it on easy like Nimitz and Erppo. " but then I beat it too, so here's a hint: Autofire rate 6.

I've left continue on, obviously letting that timer run out so restarts are from the game beginning. Aside from the powerup icons showing up (which is helpful) I don't think there is any other gameplay difference that would really invalidate the score. I'm not turning it off if there isn't any difference, because that would be silly.

[Zerst]

Not that I'm aware of, but keeping track of your powerups is very important for timing the invincibility for the towers, as well as knowing when to dive for number five if you're in a bad spot. Having to keep count in your head makes it harder to focus on the game. It's a significant difference, though I'd certainly rather play with them on.

[Ed Oscuro]

Not that I'm aware of, but keeping track of your powerups is very important for timing the invincibility for the towers, as well as knowing when to dive for number five if you're in a bad spot. Having to keep count in your head makes it harder to focus on the game. It's a significant difference, though I'd certainly rather play with them on.

No difference at all for me; I didn't look at the counters once during this play. I just pick them all up so I know that the first one activates at a useless point, and the second one activates at a more useful location. With these DIP settings, survival is the key and even if you say that the powerup is a key scoring element (ha ha) I think that playing as if it isn't helped me.

I suppose I should say that it's up to the people who want to enforce this anal change to prove that it's a worthwhile difference; I don't feel like I have anything to prove. System11 can speak for himself but I suppose the reason it was selected was really just to avoid people continuing the game (as if people ever do).

[Zerst]

I agree that the powerup display is clearly an unintended side effect of disabling continues (I'm not even sure why that dip switch does that). The issue is that there are stretches of the game later on where there are a TON of towers in a row, and lining up your powerups so that you get it at a certain spot can seriously boost your score. Doing so is far easier if you can just glance at where you're at instead of having to distract yourself from the game by counting.

Edit: Yeah, I just had a run where I had to make a decision whether to dive for an E or try to fight through a risky spot. I thought I had 4 but I had 3, got the E, and died.

[Ed Oscuro]

Edit: Yeah, I just had a run where I had to make a decision whether to dive for an E or try to fight through a risky spot. I thought I had 4 but I had 3, got the E, and died.

So basically you're dying because counting to five and / or remembering what the counter said when you looked at it during a safe moment is too hard to do at the same time as paying attention to the gameplay essentials? (I could aim that argument at myself and my stupid habit of banging the savestate key "for practice" which I never get around to, so don't feel too bad.)

OH MAN THIS E DECISION IS KILLIN ME

LITERALLY

srsly dude you're doing it wrong if this is happening, game is survival based in the long run, so pay attention to survival. This is only a "problem" if you are counting powerups rather than memorizing where you are in the stage (and you can still use that stage location awareness to trigger thoughts about if you should skip one, if you find a place where it helps to hold off on taking that final E powerup until you get to the exact right place, although I am not sure this makes sense because that would mean you ultimately get fewer powerup opportunities in the same amount of play time). Memorizing where you are in the stage and what you can expect from enemies and scoring opportunities is the easiest, if not completely optimal, way to score in this game, but I bet this one's endless anyway.

I think: "hey I got a powerup, that's nice;" doesn't make me play differently though.

[Iori Branford]

Iori Branford - 95,510

[Zerst]

I think: "hey I got a powerup, that's nice;" doesn't make me play differently though.

The potential for a player to instantly see they have four E and powerdive for the fifth when they get trapped or overwhelmed is an advantage. The claim that you have yet to personally utilize this advantage is not an argument for why you should have it. I don't care which settings are correct, just that everyone is on an even playing field.

[Ed Oscuro]

The potential for a player to instantly see they have four E and powerdive for the fifth when they get trapped or overwhelmed is an advantage.

I know what you mean here, but if you are trapped, then you are making gameplay mistakes. Maybe I need to get further in to see places where it's necessary to get the powerup to survive further (terrible game design mistake if so), but I think the way you've described it makes it clear that "diving" in a panic has gotten you killed. Given that this makes the game worse by your account, I don't see why we should say the level playing field should be here.

The claim that you have yet to personally utilize this advantage is not an argument for why you should have it.

That's not what the "claim" (as part of an argument) was meant to prove; it was just a straightforward response to your concern it unbalanced the field. Likewise the only justification you've given is "it should be removed because it's not in the settings." Well duh, we know that - I am obviously not swayed by that fact as constituting a reason that this is a good change, and in truth you haven't been helped by it either. We could still have a level playing field with the setting changed. It's not good just because it's the arbitrarily chosen setting.

Finally, you're ignoring the most important point, which is that it's not clear yet the DIP switch commandment was meant to cause this specific change (thank you for being the first person to point it out). I think it's just a mostly useless nicety so that any screaming about how bad it is to play it conveniently is just micro-managing other peoples' playing to a silly degree, but if we are going to be micro-managed I'd rather it come from System11.

Also this:

Despatche - 69,100

using hal21j for some reason

We don't know if there are scoring differences, so probably best to use hal21.

Even in that case you notice it's not an outright ban. I don't mind taking the cheap way out in that case, but I think it's obvious that there is a decent reason to have a problem with this change (intentional or otherwise, with apologies to System11 in either case), so something better than probably would be kind of nice.

[xient]

xient - 102990

[Yazphier]

Why is there discussions about looking at a counter, that is not even there if you're playing with the dip-switch setting that has been set as rules to the competition ?

[Zerst]

Why is there discussions about looking at a counter, that is not even there if you're playing with the dip-switch setting that has been set as rules to the competition ?

Because

I suppose I should say that it's up to the people who want to enforce this anal change to prove that it's a worthwhile difference; I don't feel like I have anything to prove. System11 can speak for himself but I suppose the reason it was selected was really just to avoid people continuing the game (as if people ever do).

Zerst - 355,640



Zerst - 382,580

[Herr Schatten]

Herr Schatten - 174,910

It seems you can destroy the killer buildings (with bombs?) while they are still "rising". I haven't been able to do this somewhat consistently, though.

[Frenetic]

Frenetic - 75,320

[Jeneki]

Jeneki - 154460



OMG that spinning red shit.

[Zerst]

It seems you can destroy the killer buildings (with bombs?) while they are still "rising". I haven't been able to do this somewhat consistently, though.

That's very helpful, thanks.


Zerst - 592,750


Zerst - 628,130

[Nifty]

DoubleThink - 218,730

Apparently pure reflex can do the trick

[Yazphier]

Why is there discussions about looking at a counter, that is not even there if you're playing with the dip-switch setting that has been set as rules to the competition ?

Because

I suppose I should say that it's up to the people who want to enforce this anal change to prove that it's a worthwhile difference; I don't feel like I have anything to prove. System11 can speak for himself but I suppose the reason it was selected was really just to avoid people continuing the game (as if people ever do).

And at the same time it's said that this "Anal" change makes a difference, even if it's not score wise, but makes it easier to keep track over when you will recieve your immortality (that, in turn, might or might not produce score depending on player). Regardless if this changes any score for whomever, i consider it foul..

It seems you can destroy the killer buildings (with bombs?) while they are still "rising". I haven't been able to do this somewhat consistently, though.

nice..

a few credits (with first success of killing a building with secondary fire):
Yazphier - 136970
...then back to studyin'

[MX7]

MX7 - 147,790

[Marc]

,Some crazy scores here. Mine 75,260. Getting the hang of it, and enjoying it more than I expected. Killed that boss on this go but the fucker took me out as it blew up.

[trap15]

trap15 - 139,210

Appalling. Got to second boss this time.

[Zerst]

Zerst - 730,990

[Yazphier]

Yazphier - 200,570

still not managed to get to the second boss :/, fairly successful in killing pyramids

[system11]

system11 - 95000

At least I know how to time the pickups to beat boss 1 now, not managed to bomb a pyramid though, really tough game. PCB nearly got stomped in anger a few times.

[Zerst]

At least I know how to time the pickups to beat boss 1 now, not managed to bomb a pyramid though, really tough game. PCB nearly got stomped in anger a few times.

For the pyramids, just fire a bomb and then immediately hold forward for a half-second. The pyramids match your ship's X position, but trigger when you cross a certain Y position. I got a feel for where a bunch of them are, but spend pretty much the entire game doing a vertical wobbling motion and launching bombs.

[Skykid]

101,670

And fuck, I completely forgot to play Centipede.

[Herr Schatten]

Herr Schatten - 180,020

I don't seem to make much progress anymore. Is anyone recording replays? I'd love to see a high scoring run of this.

[Zerst]

Yeah I have my 730k, i'll upload that and my millipede run in a bit.



Edit: INPs for both millipede and 730k hal21 -> http://www.mediafire.com/?5t8vodxij48fzt8
Played with wolfmame145, available here -> http://wolfmame.marpirc.net/

[xient]

xient - 138260

Thanks Zerst. That waggle method works great. Now if I could just survive.

[Skykid]

114,690