Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

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lovecraft
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by lovecraft »

prophetic wrote:
lovecraft wrote:Are you being this dense on purpose? It doesn't have to be a TV setting. You've been told at least twice that you can set the in-game scaling yourself. Stretch the x-axis and you'll get what you want. Might as well stretch the y-axis and cut off the gameplay area while you're at it. What difference does it make anyway, with how you're butchering 4:3 games?
You don't have to be patronizing, I'm not butchering nor cut off any thing, stay cool buddy 8)


I'm quoting what I read at gematsu:
RayStorm HD first launched in 2010 with additional elements and support for 16:9 aspect ratio, but RayStorm NEO-HD includes the same content as the arcade version and retains a 4:3 aspect ratio.
Maybe we don't understand what gematsu says in the same way ? Where do you see in what is written that you may do your stretching stuff ?

I guess there's a difference between "support for 16:9 aspect ratio" and "stretch your stuff yourself".
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Rastan78
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Rastan78 »

lovecraft, have you ever bought any of the other M2 ports? They always include the option the stretch to full screen. Always as in every port on HD era console ver from PSP to 360 to Switch to PS4. The Gematsu article says nothing about the scaling options, and there's absolutely zero reason to think this collection will suddenly cut out full screen mode.
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lovecraft
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by lovecraft »

Rastan78 wrote:lovecraft, have you ever bought any of the other M2 ports? They always include the option the stretch to full screen. Always as in every port on HD era console ver from PSP to 360 to Switch to PS4. The Gematsu article says nothing about the scaling options, and there's absolutely zero reason to think this collection will suddenly cut out full screen mode.
Ok.
We'll have more infos about this port soon.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by heli »

LOL 39% left.
You can argue full HD for almost 1 year.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by subcons »

lovecraft wrote:
Rastan78 wrote:lovecraft, have you ever bought any of the other M2 ports? They always include the option the stretch to full screen. Always as in every port on HD era console ver from PSP to 360 to Switch to PS4. The Gematsu article says nothing about the scaling options, and there's absolutely zero reason to think this collection will suddenly cut out full screen mode.
Ok.
We'll have more infos about this port soon.
He’s right though. I own every M2 release for current gen and every single one lets you do whatever wacky shit you want to do with the display ratio and fill the screen if you want. It’ll be there for every game in the Ray’z Collection.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by lovecraft »

subcons wrote:He’s right though. I own every M2 release for current gen and every single one lets you do whatever wacky shit you want to do with the display ratio and fill the screen if you want. It’ll be there for every game in the Ray’z Collection.

You can't help but always come out with that same scornful "wacky shit" remark. I don't do such a thing with any of my games, and it was not my question. I don't wait for you to tell me what to do or if what I'm doing is right or wrong. It's ok, got it, we're going to move on huh.

I had a doubt about the mention "support for 16:9 aspect ratio" which according to gematsu will be removed in the new port of Raystorm HD:
does "support for 16:9 aspect ratio" means the player had to stretch the image himself to his liking in the display options OR did it mean the image had a real visual overhaul done by the developers to fit the 16:9 aspect ratio screen ? That was my question. End of the debate.
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subcons
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Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by subcons »

lovecraft wrote:You can't help but always come out with that same scornful "wacky shit" remark. I don't do such a thing with any of my games, and it was not my question. I don't wait for you to tell me what to do or if what I'm doing is right or wrong. It's ok, got it, we're going to move on huh.

I had a doubt about the mention "support for 16:9 aspect ratio" which according to gematsu will be removed in the new port of Raystorm HD:
does "support for 16:9 aspect ratio" means the player had to stretch the image himself to his liking in the display options OR did it mean the image had a real visual overhaul done by the developers to fit the 16:9 aspect ratio screen ? That was my question. End of the debate.
I understand you’re getting dog piled for your preference to fill the screen with a 4:3 designed game, but there really wasn’t any scorn meant in my reply. It was just a way of saying you have complete control over the screen ratio via the settings.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by CRP »

Noticed a updated on SLG. Hope the dont release it to quickly since there will be surely a patch after digi release :)
Limited Edition: Shipping starts Spring 2023
Collector’s Edition: Shipping starts Spring 2023
Pixel Frame Special Edition: Shipping starts Spring 2023

Release dates need to follow release in Japan.
Last Edit: 17. November 2022
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Steven »

Oh shit, looks like there is a campaign for purchasers of the limited edition version of this, and one of the prizes is a RayStorm PCB! That's probably the single most awesome promotional campaign prize I've ever seen.

https://www.taito.co.jp/mob/topics/25591
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by evil_ash_xero »

It'll be so nice to finally play RayStorm in HD. When they released it in 16:9, i thought for sure they would have patched it to allow 4:3. Nope.
An ancient crime rectified.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by EmperorIng »

I wonder if the japanese collector's edition will have english translations in the books/blu rays like the G-Darius collector's set had (at least for the art book).
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by jehu »

By the way ~ a potential solution to those who still have the insane 18k yen shipping ascribed to your order.

I went to my Amazon.jp order page ('My Orders') and clicked 'Change Shipping Speed' for the Ray'z Special Edition to see what it would do to the astronomical cost.

And, lo' - even though I changed from 'Standard' to 'Priority' the total shipping cost updated from 18k yen to something like 3k yen. I haven't tested it, but I bet that if I shifted back to 'Standard' the shipping might be correctly adjusted away from the placeholder amount back to something reasonable.

I remember a few people mentioning that Amazon updates the total before shipping, so maybe this is unnecessary. But I know at least a few people got charged for the full placeholder amount on past orders and had to go through a whole dispute process.

Put my mind at ease - thought someone else might also sleep better knowing that they aren't at risk of paying upwards of $150 in shipping costs for one game.
Jonpachi wrote:We probably need to add a sticky for this, but Amazon Japan has a habit of posting high placeholder shipping fees and then updating it to a more normal number upon shipping. That said, it's happened to myself and others that they do actually charge your account that value, but will then refund you if you follow up on it.
Don't let this happen to you :shock: :shock: :shock:
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Randorama »

I went through the whole thread in a short amount of time so I probably overlooked the relevant information: apologies in advance.

So, a possible PC/Steam/etc. port will probably arrive at a later time and anyway the involved parties (Taito and M2) didn't post any update on the matter, right?
In no particular order, also...

BIL: I think that you mentioned LOGH for ST 4 of Raystorm. I think that Taito mostly ripped off the early UC Gundam vessels, didn't they? A quick glance at some pics gives me this idea but yes, the whole "Fierce Space Opera anime fight" is there (LOGH doesn't have mechs, also).

EmperorIng: I think that Raystorm is not that difficult, but I also remember spending months to play the title in co-op. We managed to 1-CC it twice, and in both cases it was a very lucky event. What I do remember is that timing and re-stocking the laser bombs was fundamental - even if your bomb usage won't net many points, you do need to clear some sections with bombs, and restocking in time is a non-negotiable requirement.

I wish that I would have had the chance to play Raycrisis in my uncle's arcade, too - but I was busy with real life and I wasn't even living in my hometown. I deeply regret not having the chance to do so, just to sound ridiculously melodramatic.

General: I believe that I place the whole series on the pedestal for a number of reasons that have little to do with the games' virtues as shmups, while also blissfully ignoring their flaws (they have none! Of course! They're absolutely perfect games!).

I am still wearing those rose-tinted glasses when I am interacting with the series (1994-2023, so that's a long rose-shaded period).

...However, the last time I played Rayforce I was moments from punching the screen after the fourth credit (!"#¤ game mechanics and, in particular, rank). Raystorm and Raycrisis are two games with which I technically have a grudge to solve, though, so I can't wait playing them in HD. I'll stock up on monitors to punch, then.

Tangent: I'd love an option that would allow me to play Tamayo K.'s arranged soundtracks during a credit, though. I absolutely adore Rubbing Beat and Rayons de l'air (and the Yukihiro Fukutomi's remix on the Scitron's release of Rayforce's OST, too). I definitely love 8-minutes muzak pieces in my gaming.
Chomsky, Buckminster Fuller, Yunus and Glass would have played Battle Garegga, for sure.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by BIL »

Randorama wrote:BIL: I think that you mentioned LOGH for ST 4 of Raystorm. I think that Taito mostly ripped off the early UC Gundam vessels, didn't they? A quick glance at some pics gives me this idea but yes, the whole "Fierce Space Opera anime fight" is there (LOGH doesn't have mechs, also).
I have to admit, my knowledge of Gundam and anime/manga in general is scant, outside of a few signal works like LOGH, Hokuto no Ken, Berserk et al - what leapt out at me (quite literally!) is st4's rather terrifying 90' laser barrages. Specifically, the way they ascend to player altitude, before streaking forward; a classically space-operatic union of elegance and destruction. Not sure if they have a clear antecedent, the way the famed "Itano Circus" missile barrage does (via Macross, IIRC?) - but yeah, I could easily imagine Taito and LOGH alike were referencing earlier Gundam works (as with the Rays' recurring mobile suits... "Ray" itself being a name even casuals like me recognise the significance of, via Amuro). The general imagery of "battleship fleets in space" is certainly seen in the earlier series:

Gundam, LOGH:
Spoiler
Image

Image


Image


Having seen LOGH before anything Gundam, it was the former that got a "Hey! I was killed by those once!" reaction from me. :mrgreen:

Lovingly recalled (along with so much other adopted Taito canon) in Border Down:
Spoiler
Image


Rayforce, G-Darius, and Border Down share another little convention that's always caught my eye: the "laser-etching" wireframe materialisation, seen in RF's second boss as it warps in (awesome sense of a fiendishly fast-deploying orbital watchdog), and on certain G-Darius and BD bosses, when replacing lost turrets, pieces, etc - the former's incarnation of Great Thing comes to mind.

Probably papers written on this stuff, I'm sure... even from my casual standpoint, I'm wondering about Yamato, VOTOMS, Macross stablemates Dunbine and Orguss (current sig), et al.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Randorama »

I don't know if there are papers on the topic. I guess not, even from Japanese experts...these are all "ancient" works, and researching them would take time and patience (It's "publish fast or perish soon", these days: writing about lolis and Isekai might result in quickly published material). Then again, I should search for relevant material first :wink:

Said this:

I am pretty sure that homing lasers, wireframe sections and ascending ships are based on some classic animation sequences that have become akin to "animation/visual tropes" (a bit like the Metal Black's bonus stages have the Itano circus dancing missiles in videogaming form). Taito programmers always tried to offer a cinematic and anime-atic experience to their works, so all these tropes as references to earlier works should not be surprising (I am being lazy and not linking to the relevant shmuplations, sorry). The same could certainly be said about other companies and games (e.g. Konami: Gradius II and Surprise Attack are two examples I can summon right now), but Taito were generally way more explicit about this intent.

For instance:

In Raystorm ST 4 should feature several of these visual tropes, but I think that the ascending lasers suddenly turning in the player's direction appear somewhere in a Harlock episode first (the '77 series), and then pop up again in several other works Macross? I haven't seen it in 25+ years or so).

On a similar note, G-Darius includes sequences that are based on Matsumoto's classics (Harlock, Yamato). The best example I can think of is the fight with Absolute Defender: a volley of lasers should start from the right side and at a deeper level than the player's position, move to the centre of the screen and curve while transiting to the left side, due to the visual effect of moving on the depth axis.

I'd add that Mech design seems more inspired by other "realistic mechas" series (Votoms, perhaps?). However, right now I am thinking that "Odin", ST 5's boss in Rayforce, and the fact that it looks like one of those chunky and yet flamboyant mechas from Nagano Mamoru's manga series (Joker galaxy, or whatever it is called).

As a teen, playing two shmups with so many obvious manga/anime/etc. references (and from Taito, even) had its own strong mesmerizing effect. Still, I remember that my gaming partner on Raystorm at some point was literally grimacing through our credits, seeking the elusive 1-CC trophy. There's a limit to how many "deaths from auto-centre ship movements" a man can withstand in a single night (or single semester, frankly...).

Bonus track: Battle Garegga features at least one Gundam reference, too: the ending credits are an homage to the "ascending flamingoes" scene from the original series (ep. 18? The "White Base" ship lifts off from the Amazonian basin and a flock of flamingoes flies away. Next destination: Space).

Ghost track: Sokyugurentai always made me think that the Raizing team had read at least Kim Stanley Robinson's Red Mars (and maybe the whole trilogy?) but also other SF works on Mars colonization, and then decided to create a hard SF world setting (do they mention this, in the shmuplation? Too lazy to re-read it). The G.Rev guys certainly did: the orbital elevator in the game is located in "Sheffield" (Valles Marineris?), like the elevator in the third book of the trilogy (and their fates should be similar).

I actually think that a paper could indeed be written on this topic: "Japanese fiction lifti---pardon, using Robinson's trilogy as a source across media", or something. It would simply describe what those pesky Japanese authors did (and wild tangent: eugh, Robinson's work is not for me). Literature colleagues would call it a "close reading", I guess.
Chomsky, Buckminster Fuller, Yunus and Glass would have played Battle Garegga, for sure.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by jehu »

Randorama wrote:Tangent: I'd love an option that would allow me to play Tamayo K.'s arranged soundtracks during a credit, though. I absolutely adore Rubbing Beat and Rayons de l'air (and the Yukihiro Fukutomi's remix on the Scitron's release of Rayforce's OST, too). I definitely love 8-minutes muzak pieces in my gaming.
This has been something I've been thinking about a lot. The arrange OSTs are fantastic, but I suspect that they may not make it on the disk/cart. I went back to M2's steam to investigate, but my non-existent Japanese didn't get me far.

All evidence I could find points to no. First, Darius collection had no arrange soundtracks. Second, M2 has not put out an arrange to accompany other recent releases. Third, though in the stream there is a 'Music' gadget for each game that labels the OST as 'Arcade,' the Toaplan releases were formatted in the same way (and had no arrange). And finally, there weren't any arrange tracks to be heard in the stream as far as I could hear.

Any news of this come out in any of the pre-release material? I think the arranges were in the ~$7 iOS ports, so would be a shame if they didn't make it here. Good opportunity for DLC even, but I don't see Taito going that route in spite of their reputation for being a bit money-grubbing.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by hamfighterx »

Randorama wrote:I don't know if there are papers on the topic. I guess not, even from Japanese experts...
My mind is a little blown by the Garegga/Gundam flamingo homage... Great post.
jehu wrote:Good opportunity for DLC even, but I don't see Taito going that route in spite of their reputation for being a bit money-grubbing.
Don't give them any Amazon.jp Prime Member exclusive DLC ideas...
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Randorama »

Hamfighterx:

No worries (="you're welcome" in Oz English). Gun Frontier should also have a similar scene on stage 2, just before the boss, and countless other anime and manga also paid a similar homage to that scene because it's really iconic.

I believe that Taito and its programmers and designers were simply closer to the anime and manga authors and companies, during their arcade years (e.g. Darius included boss designs by Tatsunoko artists, if I recall correctly). Taito games generally seemed to include more homages and references to other Japanese media than other companies' games (and non-Japanese media, Rastan and Chase H.Q. being two examples).


Jehu:

I entirely agree, but I imagine that inserting the AST's as selectable music in the games would require permission from Tamayo K., and this may not be an easy task: she should have left Zuntata and gone freelance, as I believe that she is working on anime OSTs now.

I imagine that copyright issues may not be easy to deal with, in such a case (i.e. did Taito and/or Zuntata retain the rights? Would they need to ask Tamayo?), and that the M2 staff may simply think "OK, that's lovely stuff, but we are focused on the preservation of games, not their tie-ins".

Re-releases are always good in my book - culture is hard to preserve in the bit-rot era- but the music anthology may suffice, for this specific purpose.

...I also wonder if anyone would come up with the idea to begin with, honestly.

I actually tried this option more than once (mute game, play the AST's), but there are obvious timing and atmosphere problems. Rubbing Beat features long (i.e. 8+ minutes long) songs and Rayforce stages roughly follow a standard "50+50+50 secondss" formula (bunch of enemy waves, 1-2 seconds of lull, repeat x3 --> boss), if I recall correctly.

I often use OST's to get a sense of a stage's pacing, so the mismatch was clear to my eyes and ears (and hands, even). Arcade music of decades past had to operate within constraints that other genres did not include - and the AST's were apparently Tamayo's attempt at creating "non-arcade music" based on the Rayseries core musical themes and melodies. That's what I remember reading from an automatic translation of one of the booklets at least (Rayons de l'air, perhaps?).

Nevertheless, I'd adore playing Raycrisis with the vaguely Tom Waits-esque version of Non-sentimentalisme from Rayons :wink:
Chomsky, Buckminster Fuller, Yunus and Glass would have played Battle Garegga, for sure.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by jehu »

Looks like the Ray OST Arranges are in!

https://twitter.com/TAITO_Apps/status/1 ... 2922318850

Going to be hard to top this as the premier STG drop of the year.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by dmk1198 »

How much we think this will be? UK release same day n date as Japan USA?

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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Randorama »

Jehu:

...it feels like somebody read my rants, or my likely some people had the same idea ("Hey, the AST's were ace, let's add them to the package!").
Definitely going to buy the whole package, then :wink:
Chomsky, Buckminster Fuller, Yunus and Glass would have played Battle Garegga, for sure.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by BIL »

jehu wrote:Looks like the Ray OST Arranges are in!

https://twitter.com/TAITO_Apps/status/1 ... 2922318850

Going to be hard to top this as the premier STG drop of the year.
Hoooly fuck that's awesome :shock: Total love letter to fans of Taito and ZTT.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Fingolfin »

jehu wrote above
“Looks like the Ray OST Arranges are in!”

https://twitter.com/TAITO_Apps/status/1 ... 2922318850

“Looks like the new Oldsmobiles are in early this year…”
Image

At his music exchange, Ray’s prepped, vigilant and ready for anything with Ray’z Arcade Chronology coming soon on the near horizon. Ray as in Ray Charles and his Ray’s Music Exchange :mrgreen:

Image

Very glad to know alternate Tamayo/Tanz ASTs will be included with Zuntata primary BGM OSTs: beautiful stuff indeed!

Really looking forward to this release a few weeks out! :D
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Ms. Tea »

Aside from the arranged OSTs, they've got an option to play with background ambient sounds they recorded from around the Ray cabinets on the second floor of Taito HEY in Akihabara. That's a *really* cool option, I'm definitely going to try it.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by BydoR9 »

I've already spunked up over 50 quid on the Strictly Limited version (with R-Gear 1st level/demo) back in August 2022.

Assume it won't be far behind the general release in March.

2023's looking like an expensive year to be an old man who likes old school (real) video games.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by cfx »

BydoR9 wrote:I've already spunked up over 50 quid on the Strictly Limited version (with R-Gear 1st level/demo) back in August 2022.

Assume it won't be far behind the general release in March.

2023's looking like an expensive year to be an old man who likes old school (real) video games.
Never assume that when it comes to SLG; it will only lead to disappointment and heartache. It's very unlikely it will work out that way.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by Jonpachi »

Why not just support the developers and community by buying the Japanese versions? You get it on release, you more fully support the actual developers (instead of giving LRG or SLG a cut) and there's no stress of waiting/wondering for 6+ months when your purchase is going to arrive.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by hamfighterx »

I know my reason for going with the SLG Switch release was that I was unable to snag the retailer-specific R-Gear DLC (which was available to Amazon Prime Japan members only). And the SLG version includes that on the cart/disc, even on the standard $50 editions - don't need to buy the expensive super-deluxe version.

Had they included that by default in the Japanese retail release, that's what I would have chosen.

I probably will still grab the PS4 version too... question is whether I just get the PSN release at launch, or order the physical LE for the soundtrack/Blu ray.
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Re: Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

Post by TransatlanticFoe »

Strictly Limited will release after the JP one so that if patches are planned, they'll press the patched version. It's unlikely it'll take forever to release, it's only really Turrican that got a horrendous delay (too many bugs, feature creep) and covid-based disruption has improved. This is M2, it's unlikely to need any major post-release work and expect M2 already know if anything needs patching.

So we want translated menus but we don't want to give a localised publisher money because the JP release is the "fullest" way to support the devs? If you want it quicker (or easier, given global shipping can be entertaining) that's fine - but if Strictly Limited hadn't picked this up you can bet the menus would've been Japanese only (as per Toaplan and Aleste), so their presence in this isn't without worth.
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