Ray'z Arcade Chronology [Taito x M2] - PS4/Switch [2023]

[Rastan78]

It's very disappointing that the 16:9 aspect ratio is removed in RayStorm HD, it worked fine on 360 and it's nice to play in full screen also.
Why don't they let the player choose the aspect ratio instead of imposing the 4:3 ??

IIRC RayStorm HD simply used the game at 4:3 stretched to fill the screen. See this screen, and notice how the planet is an ellipse not a circle:



So yeah almost all M2 ports already allow you to stretch that way if that's your thing.

If you force 4:3 via your tv settings when playing the 360 HD ver it looks more correct. This makes sense bc a few Japanese sources say HD was intended to be in 4:3 and the 16:9 aspect was a last minute thing done simply to increase the likelihood of passing MS and Sony certification.

To truly make the game 16:9 without stretching or cropping would pretty much mean full rebalancing and/or having separate leaderboards.

Edit: And here's the PCB. Much more natural looking. And by comparing the HUD in the upper left you can see how even that got stretched out and looks too wide in the HD port:

[lovecraft]

It's very disappointing that the 16:9 aspect ratio is removed in RayStorm HD, it worked fine on 360 and it's nice to play in full screen also.
Why don't they let the player choose the aspect ratio instead of imposing the 4:3 ??

IIRC RayStorm HD simply used the game at 4:3 stretched to fill the screen. See this screen, and notice how the planet is an ellipse not a circle:



So yeah almost all M2 ports already allow you to stretch that way if that's your thing.

If you force 4:3 via your tv settings when playing the 360 HD ver it looks more correct. This makes sense bc a few Japanese sources say HD was intended to be in 4:3 and the 16:9 aspect was a last minute thing done simply to increase the likelihood of passing MS and Sony certification.

To truly make the game 16:9 without stretching or cropping would pretty much mean full rebalancing and/or having separate leaderboards.

Ok but I don't care, I appreciated to play the HD version in full screen, it had something immersive, and there are almost only 16:9 screens on the market these days, so you might as well use them. They should just allow the player to choose instead of forcing them to a single choice with a 4:3 aspect ratio with bars on each side.

[Rastan78]

Like I said almost every port these days including M2 ones do allow you to stretch to 16:9 if you don't care about preserving the arcade aspect. What's the problem?

[Jeneki]

Oddly enough my TVs has an option to stretch 4:3 content to 16:9 (even if the input resolution is 16:9, it'll stretch out what would be 4:3 and cutoff anything outside that area). Might be worth searching through your TV options and see if you have something similar, as that will work with anything you want to stretch.

Note: I don't endorse gaming in an incorrect aspect ratio. Just giving information to those who may find it useful.

[lovecraft]

Like I said almost every port these days including M2 ones do allow you to stretch to 16:9 if you don't care about preserving the arcade aspect. What's the problem?

I missed the line, I replied to your first remark. But according to what I read at gematsu, they chose to retain a 4:3 aspect ratio only in this new HD version. It might change though.

[Rastan78]

Well there are a few games where M2 has added a true 16:9 aspect (not just 4:3 stretched via the screen scaling menu). Usually it's a racing game like Out Run or Virtua Racing.

[TransatlanticFoe]

It's very disappointing that the 16:9 aspect ratio is removed in RayStorm HD, it worked fine on 360 and it's nice to play in full screen also.
Why don't they let the player choose the aspect ratio instead of imposing the 4:3 ??

IIRC RayStorm HD simply used the game at 4:3 stretched to fill the screen. See this screen, and notice how the planet is an ellipse not a circle:



So yeah almost all M2 ports already allow you to stretch that way if that's your thing.

If you force 4:3 via your tv settings when playing the 360 HD ver it looks more correct. This makes sense bc a few Japanese sources say HD was intended to be in 4:3 and the 16:9 aspect was a last minute thing done simply to increase the likelihood of passing MS and Sony certification.

To truly make the game 16:9 without stretching or cropping would pretty much mean full rebalancing and/or having separate leaderboards.

Ok but I don't care, I appreciated to play the HD version in full screen, it had something immersive, and there are almost only 16:9 screens on the market these days, so you might as well use them. They should just allow the player to choose instead of forcing them to a single choice with a 4:3 aspect ratio with bars on each side.

People who stretch a 4:3 image to widescreen, just so it fills the entire screen, are bad and you should feel bad

[Strider77]

Ok but I don't care, I appreciated to play the HD version in full screen, it had something immersive, and there are almost only 16:9 screens on the market these days, so you might as well use them. They should just allow the player to choose instead of forcing them to a single choice with a 4:3 aspect ratio with bars on each side.

Mods ban please...

[Rob]

I like the box-art better from japan :


Nicer then :

The western version is for ass men.

[heli]

Well there are a few games where M2 has added a true 16:9 aspect (not just 4:3 stretched via the screen scaling menu). Usually it's a racing game like Out Run or Virtua Racing.

Take a emulator that renders a bigger viewport and you will see that the background just stops, you only see the sky.
If games have the data to render more, its easy, they could also themselfs get creative and release 2025.

[lovecraft]

People who stretch a 4:3 image to widescreen, just so it fills the entire screen, are bad and you should feel bad

Ok but I don't care, I appreciated to play the HD version in full screen, it had something immersive, and there are almost only 16:9 screens on the market these days, so you might as well use them. They should just allow the player to choose instead of forcing them to a single choice with a 4:3 aspect ratio with bars on each side.

Mods ban please...

No need to be arrogant or bigoted, one has the right to play in 16:9, even an old arcade game. Actually I have the original RayStorm PCB, and sometimes I play it on my 16:9 TV in full screen, it works fine for me. Also it depends on the quality of your screen. But I don't judge those who only play it in original 4:3 aspect ratio.
Since the HD version originally released on X360 was in 16:9, I hope M2 will keep this option for those like me who like to play this particular game in full screen.

[Rastan78]

You can even stretch vertical 3:4 games to 16:9 for dat full immersion. No more need to rotate that bitch. Not my setup btw.

[lovecraft]

You can even stretch vertical 3:4 games to 16:9 for dat full immersion. No more need to rotate that bitch. Not my setup btw.

Yeah, and Raystorm is a vertical game also...

[Bassa-Bassa]

Is there really a difference? You're still distorting the intended aspect ratio. If something was drawn at 4:3, by displaying it at 16:9 you're not only deforming the picture, but also messing with the displacement axes. Likely what he meant but found too elementary to explain in 2022 without a joke.

[Rastan78]

Well back to more real discussion of stretching vs original 4:3, the real issue besides artwork looking stretched is also horizontal movement speed. It increases when you stretch the screen while the vertical movement stays the same.

Now if you took a regular horizontal game like G Darius instead, stretched 16:9 is gonna feel pretty bad. It just messes with the regularity of the X, Y grid that you're positioning your ship on every time you move. Also moving diagonal will not really be diagonal which will fuck with your spacing and dodging ability slightly.

With RayStorm in particular you have this unusual tilted view that makes movement feel different than most other games. I could see the argument that it plays well stretched or even that some patterns are a bit easier having a little more space to judge the angle to dodge at.

So it doesn't totally surprise me that some would prefer RayStorm stretched. In general though, I'd say stretching is a bad habit and you don't want to acclimate too much to have a warped angle to your movement on a 2D plane.

[lovecraft]

A few of my captures of 4:3 old games played in full screen on a 16:9 tv, not saying they *must* be played with this aspect ratio. Just to say they work fine for me in full screen. Anyway I can switch 4:3 any time.

[lovecraft]

This is just subjective ! Again I do understand those who play their old game in 4:3 only (I know they were intended to be displayed in 4:3)

[TransatlanticFoe]

People who stretch a 4:3 image to widescreen, just so it fills the entire screen, are bad and you should feel bad

Ok but I don't care, I appreciated to play the HD version in full screen, it had something immersive, and there are almost only 16:9 screens on the market these days, so you might as well use them. They should just allow the player to choose instead of forcing them to a single choice with a 4:3 aspect ratio with bars on each side.

Mods ban please...

No need to be arrogant or bigoted, one has the right to play in 16:9, even an old arcade game. Actually I have the original RayStorm PCB, and sometimes I play it on my 16:9 TV in full screen, it works fine for me. Also it depends on the quality of your screen. But I don't judge those who only play it in original 4:3 aspect ratio.
Since the HD version originally released on X360 was in 16:9, I hope M2 will keep this option for those like me who like to play this particular game in full screen.

It's not about old arcade games, it's about not smearing the image across the screen. Do you watch old Simpsons episodes stretched over 16:9 making everyone short and wide? Or fill the screen by lopping everyone's head off occasionally? You're entitled to find a way to mash up the image on your display, of course - but you can't do something ridiculous and expect people not to laugh at you.

[lovecraft]

It's not about old arcade games, it's about not smearing the image across the screen. Do you watch old Simpsons episodes stretched over 16:9 making everyone short and wide? Or fill the screen by lopping everyone's head off occasionally? You're entitled to find a way to mash up the image on your display, of course - but you can't do something ridiculous and expect people not to laugh at you.

Read my response above please.
Do you understand the meaning of "SUBJECTIVE" ?

[lovecraft]

Do you watch old Simpsons episodes stretched over 16:9 making everyone short and wide?

No I don't. But I already played the arcade game by Konami on a 16:9 screen, and nothing shocked me, it worked fine for me.

[TransatlanticFoe]

Why not rotate your monitor and stretch it vertically? It's the same thing. Again you can do what you want but it's a ridiculous thing to do if you can view in the correct aspect ratio. It's not subjective, the thing was designed to be in 4:3. It's like asking a retro compilation to include a 50 Hz option for games developed to run at 60 Hz. Some of us stuck with PAL back in the day have a Stockholm Syndrome retro relationship with 50 Hz but christ me it would be insane to expect an option to play something developed for 60 Hz at 50 Hz.

[lovecraft]

Why not rotate your monitor and stretch it vertically? It's the same thing. Again you can do what you want but it's a ridiculous thing to do if you can view in the correct aspect ratio. It's not subjective, the thing was designed to be in 4:3. It's like asking a retro compilation to include a 50 Hz option for games developed to run at 60 Hz. Some of us stuck with PAL back in the day have a Stockholm Syndrome retro relationship with 50 Hz but christ me it would be insane to expect an option to play something developed for 60 Hz at 50 Hz.

I understand your point, but I disagree. If the game is played vertically, I turn my screen 90° to "tate". I'm not talking about vertical or horizontal orientation, but just the aspect of these games in full screen on my 16:9 screen, it doesn't shock me and I appreciate an image that fills my entire screen whether the game is horizontal or requires the screen to be rotated 90°, that's why I tell it's subjective.
But in this thread I was only talking about RayStorm HD which was in 16:9 on 360 and which M2 apparently wants to limit to 4:3 in this new version.

[Ms. Tea]

To surface a post from earlier in this thread, the devs didn't seem happy about having to make RayStorm HD 16:9 to begin with: viewtopic.php?p=1495464#p1495464 I really don't think it's a surprise that M2 are taking this chance to un-do that change.

[Bassa-Bassa]

I understand your point, but I disagree. If the game is played vertically, I turn my screen 90° to "tate". I'm not talking about vertical or horizontal orientation, but just the aspect of these games in full screen on my 16:9 screen, it doesn't shock me

I think his point is that it should. For some strong reasons. Much stronger than the need to fill the screen. As it is, one should only be playing 4:3 15khz games on 4:3 15khz CRTs, so if that's not the case, try to at least mimic that as much as possible.

[lovecraft]

4:3 15khz games on 4:3 15khz CRTs

Granted, nothing better than a 15khz CRT.
But it's not easy to find a new 4:3 screen on the market these days, and almost impossible with CRT technology. There are still these vintage arcade cabinets with CRT screens, but not everyone owns an arcade cab. For this reason, manufacturers often add Scanlines filters in screen options for this type of game on the modern consoles.

[Soulless187]

You won't be disappointed, I promise! I think its official name might translate to "Lightning Katana," but at any rate, it's a monster! Siter Skain were hugely influenced by Raizing-style burning shrapnel carnivals, and this thing shears through metal motherfuckers but good. And bullets! Not lasers, though! Toss in an inimitably technothereal atmosphere of electric driven sorrow - less Rayforce's bitterly resolved 11th-hour suicide run, or Souky's ice-cold mercenary hits, more a karmic godhammer falling onto its doomed venal target at terminal velocity - for a love letter to Rayforce and Souky that, much like M2 and their Gauntlet X68k port, is easily on the level of the pros themselves.

These Dudes Came To BLOW SHIT UP MOTHERFUCKER (ta again Jaimers for premium-grade demo footage!)

100% agree, I am a huge fan of all three games, Alltyanx second, Reflex and Kamui ( id love to try alltyanx but fuck the FW towns marty emu, and project raidwind can't find anywhere)

If you dig rayforce you owe it to yourself to give Kamui a chance. Once you get into the story and understand how the trilogy works its even better as you can see little nods to each game in the other games.

I can't say enough good things about Siter Skain...except I wish the mech game would hurry up and come out. I know its three guys doing this in their spare time but hot dam man it Dragoon whatever looks fantastic.

The Ray games are all classic. Rayforce (layer section/gunlock) is my person fav but im getting into Raystorm. Watching SDC333 on twitch try to 1cc it kinda peaked my interest. I've never given RayCrisis a honest chance and when I get this I will be sure to give it a honest chance to impress me.

I'm just glad there is a western release both digital and physical (grr SLG but better then nothing I eventually got my Cotton reboot and Gdarius/Dariusbirst AC disks) for this. I was scared this was going to be like ESP Ra.De PSI and be locked to japan PSN. Come one M2 release ESP rade on NA PSN (along with sorcer striker) its not like you got anything to lose.

[XtraSmiley]

It's not about old arcade games, it's about not smearing the image across the screen. Do you watch old Simpsons episodes stretched over 16:9 making everyone short and wide? Or fill the screen by lopping everyone's head off occasionally? You're entitled to find a way to mash up the image on your display, of course - but you can't do something ridiculous and expect people not to laugh at you.

Read my response above please.
Do you understand the meaning of "SUBJECTIVE" ?

I don't share your love of stretching, but I don't think it's that big a deal, especially for all the shit you're getting! Play how you want man! I do have to ask, can't you just choose the option on your TV to stretch it even without an in-game option, or does the affect the game in some way?

[lovecraft]

It's not about old arcade games, it's about not smearing the image across the screen. Do you watch old Simpsons episodes stretched over 16:9 making everyone short and wide? Or fill the screen by lopping everyone's head off occasionally? You're entitled to find a way to mash up the image on your display, of course - but you can't do something ridiculous and expect people not to laugh at you.

Read my response above please.
Do you understand the meaning of "SUBJECTIVE" ?

I don't share your love of stretching, but I don't think it's that big a deal, especially for all the shit you're getting! Play how you want man! I do have to ask, can't you just choose the option on your TV to stretch it even without an in-game option, or does the affect the game in some way?

Man, my TV does not offer geometry settings, it resizes the image automatically either in full or in 4:3. However, I can set the geometry myself via the upscaler ( https://i.postimg.cc/bwtQ3WRL/s-l1600-1.jpg ), here I am speaking of PCBs + Supergun SCART-connected.
Again, I did NOT say that playing these games in 16:9 full screen was the right thing to do, I said the result I get on my Toshiba big screen is fine *for me*, that's just me, I don't claim to be right, I might not like it on another screen, don't know...
But yes, if you ask me, I definitely prefer full screen on a 4:3 CRT 15khz to play these games, nothing can beat that !

And to answer your question, I repeat: rather than stretching the image myself in the tv settings, my point was to say that I would have preferred M2 keep the HD version as it was on 360, BUT with the addition of a 4:3 aspect ratio option, so players can choose if they want to play full screen or 4:3 with bars on sides.

[Steven]

Hey cool, free ZUNTATA live which is going to be recorded and put in this collection's limited edition: https://www.taito.co.jp/mob/topics/25408

100 people will be allowed to attend. It's free, so I might as well apply for it, even if my chances of getting an invitation are super minuscule.

Good luck! And tell 'em shumps farm sent you. Or maybe don't.

lol yeah, maybe I will if I actually get an invitation! I'll be sure to wear one of my Toaplan shirts if/when I go just so I look super weird and out-of-place on the Blu-ray!

[prophetic]

[quote="lovecraft"]
And to answer your question, I repeat: rather than stretching the image myself in the tv settings, my point was to say that I would have preferred M2 keep the HD version as it was on 360, BUT with the addition of a 4:3 aspect ratio option, so players can choose if they want to play full screen or 4:3 with bars on sides.[/quote]

Are you being this dense on purpose? It doesn't have to be a TV setting. You've been told at least twice that you can set the in-game scaling yourself. Stretch the x-axis and you'll get what you want. Might as well stretch the y-axis and cut off the gameplay area while you're at it. What difference does it make anyway, with how you're butchering 4:3 games?