Genesis/Megadrive Mini II - Silpheed Sega CD,Thunderforce IV

[Jonpachi]

https://www.ign.com/articles/sega-mega- ... s-included

Not a ton of game titles released so far, but some pretty serious gems on the list:

Silpheed (Mega CD)
Shining Force CD (Mega CD)
Sonic CD (Mega CD)
Mansion of Hidden Souls (Mega CD)
Popful Mail (Mega CD)
Virtua Racing (Mega Drive)
Bonanza Bros (Mega Drive)
Shining in the Darkness (Mega Drive)
Thunder Force IV (Mega Drive)
Magical Taruruto (Mega Drive)
Fantasy Zone (Mega Drive port)

UPDATE: Now coming to North America exclusively through Amazon.

https://www.polygon.com/23207254/sega-g ... der-amazon

[hamfighterx]

Deleting my post (was writing it when Jonpachi posted this one!), but to pull in a few additional points from what I wrote:

Japanese site: https://sega.jp/mdmini2/. The release date is October 27 in Japan, ¥9,980. It's in the style of the MD/Genesis model 2, comes with a 6 button pad. Presumably a Genesis Mini 2 for the US market will also show up, but I haven't seen that confirmed. I would have gone insane for a Saturn mini, but I can get behind staying in the 16-bit era this time since it does give some representation to a whole new Sega system (Mega CD).

11 games announced today (see Jonpachi's list above) with more to come in 4 further announcements: June 24, Mid July, Early August, Late August.

Personally, I'm super hopeful that Robo-Aleste makes an appearance on one of the next announced batches! Feels like a realistic hope too, considering that MUSHA Aleste made it to the previous MD Mini (as well as the Switch Online MD/Genesis games), and if M2 has any say in these selections you just know they'd be pushing for it.

Aside from Fantasy Zone MD, I wonder what we'll see for other new M2 ports to MD (like the Darius port on the previous mini!) - it appears that there will be more in addition to Fantasy Zone.

[BulletMagnet]

I passed on the original Genesis Mini since I already have most of those titles on Steam, but this one looks to be a deeper delve into the library; if a US edition (or English language support) is announced and the full game list keeps up the pace, I might just have to go for it this time...

[Bassa-Bassa]

Reminder that the more these minis sell, the longer the next M2 Shottriggers releases will take. The world needs a proper port of Batrider for a capable system, not another of Fantasy Zone for inferior hardware on an underpowered, laggy-as-hell device. Please, agree with me.

[Gaiaresis1]

Reminder that the more these minis sell, the longer the next M2 Shottriggers releases will take. The world needs a proper port of Batrider for a capable system, not another of Fantasy Zone for inferior hardware on an underpowered, laggy-as-hell device. Please, agree with me.

No, because I have my doubts M2 makes any money on these Shottriggers releases. We want M2 to be profitable so they can work on passion projects like Shottriggers.

[XtraSmiley]

Reminder that the more these minis sell, the longer the next M2 Shottriggers releases will take. The world needs a proper port of Batrider for a capable system, not another of Fantasy Zone for inferior hardware on an underpowered, laggy-as-hell device. Please, agree with me.

Batrider? I think you need to get a MiSTer!

https://github.com/psomashekar/pr4m0d-M ... p/Batrider

And yes, I AGREE with you!

[Bassa-Bassa]

Reminder that the more these minis sell, the longer the next M2 Shottriggers releases will take. The world needs a proper port of Batrider for a capable system, not another of Fantasy Zone for inferior hardware on an underpowered, laggy-as-hell device. Please, agree with me.

Batrider? I think you need to get a MiSTer!

I bought the FPGA component in December and still waiting for it, lol. Is that core's author getting help from people actually knowing the game(s) or is it more like a Mame development?

No, because I have my doubts M2 makes any money on these Shottriggers releases. We want M2 to be profitable so they can work on passion projects like Shottriggers.

Non-profitable passion projects don't get reissues. And they do physical editions, brand new cover art, buy entire franchises... they make money for sure. Not as much as with the Sega things, that's the problem.

[XtraSmiley]

He owns all the PCBs and his goal is PCB accuracy, BUT this is his first attempt at a MiSTer core, so he's learning as he's going.

[hamfighterx]

Reminder that the more these minis sell, the longer the next M2 Shottriggers releases will take. The world needs a proper port of Batrider for a capable system, not another of Fantasy Zone for inferior hardware on an underpowered, laggy-as-hell device. Please, agree with me.

In addition to wanting M2 to make money to fund more ShotTriggers stuff and similar niche/less profitable games, I'm not sure exactly how much overlap there is in M2's development teams. So this might not impact ShotTriggers as much as you think.

For the past several years they have consistently worked on multiple projects simultaneously. Here's a surely non-exhaustive list of stuff they worked on while also putting out ShotTriggers games:
- Sega Ages series for Switch
- Sega games for Nintendo Switch Online
- Capcom Arcade Stadium (contributed to it, in addition to not-related M-Two)
- Multiple Konami collections (Castlevania, Contra, Castlevania GBA, Konami Arcade)
- Multiple Namco collections (Namco Museum Archives, Namcot Collection)
- Multiple mini consoles: MD/Genesis Mini, PCE/TG16 Mini, Game Gear Micro
- Senjin Aleste and Aleste Branch
- Developed an entire new Game Gear game in GG Aleste 3 (released on a ShotTriggers compilation, but yeah)
- Darius Cozmic Collection and G Darius HD
- Legend of Mana
- Collection of Mana
- Mega Man X Legacy Collection
- Koihime Enbu series
- Skullgirls (NESiCAxLive)
- Getsu Fuma Den (NES port released alongside the new game)
- Yakuza/Judgment series - ports of retro Sega games
- 8-bit ADV Steins;Gate game (released with Steins;Gate Elite)

Without knowing exactly who works on which projects, just from the size of that list you kinda have to assume they have multiple teams that are fairly separate, working simultaneously on different things. IDK how much of the core ShotTriggers team get pulled into other work (or vice versa), and I'd assume there is SOME level of overlap and dev resource sharing within the company, but I'd be shocked if they don't have a certain amount of dedicated people continuously working on the Toaplan/ShotTriggers stuff. And perhaps even if those developers do work on multiple projects, they're working on different stuff like the Aleste games (whereas the team doing things like the contract work for Namco, Konami, Sega... maybe that's just a largely separate set of individuals?)

I'd be interested to see if anyone has further info about exactly how M2's dev organization is structured though, and who works on what.

[Bassa-Bassa]

I'm sorry for not providing the links right now but M2's Horii has indeed mentioned more than once that they had to put Shottriggers developments on hold due to the minis as the teams do overlap. They of course have different teams, but not enough people as they're small. We already discussed the subject here.

Aside from the quality M2 releases we might be missing or not, I'm more concerned about the lack of criticism in a forum like this with stuff like the minis. There isn't a single mini console after all this time without performance issues, and indeed the previous Megadrive was particularly bad at latency. I get the point for fans of Shining Force or Phantasy Star, but this is Shmups Forum and there're much better options today for old home games.

[XtraSmiley]

I'm sorry for not providing the links right now but M2's Horii has indeed mentioned more than once that they had to put Shottriggers developments on hold due to the minis as the teams do overlap. They of course have different teams, but not enough people as they're small. We already discussed the subject here.

Aside from the quality M2 releases we might be missing or not, I'm more concerned about the lack of criticism in a forum like this with stuff like the minis. There isn't a single mini console after all this time without performance issues, and indeed the previous Megadrive was particularly bad at latency. I get the point for fans of Shining Force or Phantasy Star, but this is Shmups Forum and there're much better options today for old home games.

I agree, but these mini's probably sell a lot more than the ST releases. It's a financial decision at the end of the day.

We have to hope now that the mini is done (or close) they move back to ST. I wish the ST games were coming out faster!

[bigbadboaz]

HOW MANY TIMES are they going to do the same goddamn thing?

[Steven]

Hopefully it doesn't have 3~7 frames of lag again. Even my slow brain finds Sonic 2 borderline unplayable on the last one. I'd be surprised if this isn't exactly the same hardware internally, though.

They said there will be 幻の名作 on here, so expect some ultra rare ultra expensive famous game(s)... no way it would be Eliminate Down, right? They already have 2 extremely expensive Mega Drive games on the previous one: Snow Bros. and Comix Zone, and the only other ones I can think of aside from Eliminate Down are Panorama Cotton, Twinkle Tale, Pulseman, and Ristar, although I'm probably forgetting something. No, Tetris doesn't count since apparently the previous MD Mini's Tetris was a new Tetris and not the one that got cancelled after they printed like 6 copies of it.

Anyway, why are they using the Sega Ages artwork for Thunder Force IV instead of the actual box art?

[subcons]

Reminder that the more these minis sell, the longer the next M2 Shottriggers releases will take. The world needs a proper port of Batrider for a capable system, not another of Fantasy Zone for inferior hardware on an underpowered, laggy-as-hell device. Please, agree with me.

I’d love to see Batrider as much as anyone, but it’s off the table until they move on from PS4/Switch as their platforms of choice. They reached the limit for their emulation with Garegga. I imagine it had to be a deciding factor in their focus on this older Toaplan stuff, which I’m honestly loving, much to my surprise.

At least as long as M2 is around, we should get a steady drip of excellent STG content, even if it’s not as fast as we’d all like.

[Steven]

So what's the deal with Batrider again? It runs on the Toaplan V2, just like Garegga, Mahou Daisakusen, and some other stuff they've already released or have announced. Does the Batrider PCB have something unusual that those other games don't have like some kind of exclusive daughterboard or something?

[subcons]

All I recall is that they’ve done the work on emulating Batrider, but it wasn’t running up to their standards on PS4 hardware. That was 2018 though and they were still smoothing out emulation on the Switch at the time, so maybe circumstances have changed? I don’t know what specifically would hold Batrider back compared to Garegga though.

[hamfighterx]

I’d love to see Batrider as much as anyone, but it’s off the table until they move on from PS4/Switch as their platforms of choice. They reached the limit for their emulation with Garegga. I imagine it had to be a deciding factor in their focus on this older Toaplan stuff, which I’m honestly loving, much to my surprise.

At least as long as M2 is around, we should get a steady drip of excellent STG content, even if it’s not as fast as we’d all like.

Pretty much my opinion too. I've come around to the Toaplan games thanks to these releases, after not having been super into them before. Perhaps part of that decision to even go for releasing their whole catalog was indeed due to running into some technical challenges with other harder to port games.

The idea that stuff like Batrider would require a more powerful system is a bit surprising though, since as noted, they have other games from the same hardware already in the ShotTriggers line. And hell, M2 was doing incredible ports from more powerful arcade hardware like the Cave CV1000 back on the Xbox 360 - they really couldn't do the same quality work on a PS4? Though perhaps the Switch is more of a limiting factor, if they're all in on that platform (which wouldn't be an illogical decision).

I'm not that stressed about it though, we've had a pretty steady stream of excellent STG releases from M2 these last several years even while they've picked up tons of other projects as noted above. If it takes some time for them to get through the Toaplan catalog and back around to porting stuff like Batrider or Ibara Kuro (which are playable via other means anyway), so be it. I'm not starving for games.

[Steven]

Non-profitable passion projects don't get reissues.

Uh...

https://twitter.com/M2_game/status/1523492452589465600

yeah they do, apparently. Either that or they are actually profitable.

Anyway, I hope this new mini does well. The Genesis Mini's game selection was mostly very safe, but the Japanese and Asian Mega Drive Mini libraries are surprisingly excellent, and have a lot of great selections, like Langrisser II, Slap Fight MD, Assault Suit Leynos, Rent-a-Hero, Alisia Dragoon, The Hybrid Front, Vampire Killer, and Game no Kan(d)zume (BTW the Mega-CD versions do actually come in a can, in case you've never seen them), although some of these are on the international versions as well.

I expect this will be an even more interesting selection. Sega got almost all of the big titles out on the previous MD Mini, so they'll likely want to get some really cool shit here for Serious Mega Drivers™ like myself. Of course, truly Serious Mega Drivers™ will buy it anyway no matter what's on it, so...

[hamfighterx]

HOW MANY TIMES are they going to do the same goddamn thing?

HOW MANY TIMES have we seen re-releases of Mega CD games? Almost never. For that reason alone, I really don't see this as the same as previous attempts to re-publish the same Genesis games again and again.

Anyway, I hope this new mini does well. The Genesis Mini's game selection was mostly very safe, but the Japanese and Asian Mega Drive Mini libraries are surprisingly excellent, and have a lot of great selections, like Langrisser II, Slap Fight MD, Assault Suit Leynos, Rent-a-Hero, Alisia Dragoon, The Hybrid Front, Vampire Killer, and Game no Kan(d)zume (BTW the Mega-CD versions do actually come in a can, in case you've never seen them), although some of these are on the international versions as well.

Alisia Dragoon was actually on all regions (and a great selection).

For the new mini, there are a handful of highly notable MD/Genesis games that didn't show up on the first one to be big name highlights here. Some that come to mind would be Phantasy Star 2 and 3, Golden Axe 2 and 3, Streets of Rage 1 and 3, After Burner II. I'll bet Quackshot gets in (Castle of Illusion was on the first one, Quackshot has been ported before by M2). Also a decent chance some of the region exclusive titles from the first mini show up in other regions on this one (Shinobi III was NA exclusive, Shining Force II was Asia exclusive, etc.)

Surely we'll see some quirky and interesting stuff too, and there's still gold to be mined from the cartridge library with stuff like Ranger-X/Ex Ranza, Bio-Hazard Battle/Crying, Dragon Slayer: Eiyuu Densetsu I and II, Sorcerian, Rocket Knight Adventures...

The CD stuff is more exciting to me though, since outside of specific single titles like Sonic CD, most of this stuff has never been re-released. I'm totally down for some Robo/Denin Aleste or Dark Wizard. Snatcher would be pretty great.

[Steven]

Snatcher is almost certain to not happen, mostly because there is no Japanese Mega-CD version. Crying, Dark Wizard, Keiou, Lunar, Rocket Knight Adventures, maybe Sparkster, and Quackshot would be really great. It would be even more awesome if they somehow decided to put Maui Mallard, a PAL-exclusive, on here. I really do think that since they got the typical Golden Axe/Space Harrier II/etc. stuff out on the first mini that they'll get all sorts of really cool/obscure games on here, stuff like Granada, Eliminate Down, and Twinkle Tale.

They made some crazy choices on the previous one, though, namely Game no Kan(d)zume, which was a Sega Channel exclusive and never got a retail release, and of course Darius and Tetris, the 2 new ports. They've already shown that they are doing that type of thing again with this new Fantasy Zone, so maybe we'll get something really crazy, like... a super downgraded Sakura Taisen Mega-CD port. That would be fucking insane. No way in hell that that would happen, but it's just an example. And it would be really cool if it did.

After Burner II would be interesting under certain circumstances, like if they somehow made it compatible with analog controllers. You know about the XE-1AP, right? The game supports that. I actually have one of those controllers, but the throttle slider doesn't work properly, and I have absolutely no idea how to fix it. It's really cool to play Space Harrier on the Super 32X with the XE-1AP, though, since that doesn't use the throttle. Not much point in specifically choosing to play it that way instead of on Switch, but it's still really damn cool. How many other 1988 home consoles are there with dual analog controllers and games that support dual analog? Yep, that's right, none~

[Atariboy]

With how English friendly many Japanese releases are (Sometimes being fully in English even), they could just put the western release of Snatcher on here if they wanted to. Most all of their customers would know the language.

[Martinov]

I reckon we'll see Final Fight CD, Afterburner II, Rocket Knight Adventures and Ranger X/Ex Ranza.

[Ghegs]

Kind of surprising that Sega goes for another round on the Mini-console market on a system they did already, rather than doing a Mini for Master System or Saturn, but I guess the former doesn't have the same appeal/sales potential and the latter would require a far bigger investment to make the games play even semi-decently. And the Mega Drive certainly has library left to explore.

Will be interesting to see the final line-up, and what the English language support will be like for the Japanese version. I do hope they'll refrain from having region-exclusive games this time, though. I got the Asian Mega Drive Mini because it has Alien Soldier, but that also means I didn't get Dynamite Headdy and Shinobi III. Kind of dumb.

[Martinov]

I got the Asian Mega Drive Mini because it has Alien Soldier, but that also means I didn't get Dynamite Headdy and Shinobi III. Kind of dumb.

Dynamite Headdy is on the Asian MD Mini (along with Aladdin, Gauntlet IV and the Asian port of Marble Madness), but you have to hack it to unlock it.

[Steven]

This thing is, amazingly, already sold out. Kind of interesting given that almost nobody here cares about the Mega Drive at all. You can still buy it in the super expensive sets, but that's more than what I'm willing to pay for what is almost certain to be a disappointing, laggy, and sub-par emulator box that looks like a tiny MD2.

I did preorder the Mega Drive Mini Tower 2, though. The system itself will be back in stock eventually, I imagine, so I'll just wait until then to preorder it. I have the MD Mini and the MD Tower Mini and the MD Tower Mini Zero already, so it will be nice to actually have something to put the Mega Adaptor Mini on. Too bad I will have to choose between having the Super 32X, the Mega Adaptor, or nothing at all. Solution: get another system so I can have all 3?!

[Sima Tuna]

It's sold out because of scalpers and hoarder-collector types who don't actually play games. Who the hell wants to play on a laggy mini console when they can play on lagless emulation?

I'm also well and truly tired of seeing the same games released over and over. Virtua Racing, Bonanza Bros, Thunder Force IV and Fantasy Zone already have definitive commercial releases for modern consoles.

[bigbadboaz]

HOW MANY TIMES have we seen re-releases of Mega CD games? Almost never. For that reason alone, I really don't see this as the same as previous attempts to re-publish the same Genesis games again and again.

It may be a different form, but they've already released a freakin' mini for this platform! This is even worse because it's another hunk of plastic and electronics when they could have simply found a way to sell augmented game packs for the machine they already sent out into the marketplace.

They've completely ignored the fanbase's pleas to move on for two decades.. now they're making entire machines one-off, disposable items!? It's fucking despicable.

[Bassa-Bassa]

This is even worse because it's another hunk of plastic and electronics when they could have simply found a way to sell augmented game packs for the machine they already sent out into the marketplace.

They've completely ignored the fanbase's pleas to move on for two decades.. now they're making entire machines one-off, disposable items!? It's fucking despicable.

That's a sentiment I can share, but it's just responding to a demand, mirroring a fan base which is more about quantity and cuteness than quality and playtime, just check this thread. What makes of it all a really despicable irony is that they're wasting the efforts and time of basically the only people who actually care about accuracy and have the means to deliver.

[Sengoku Strider]

Kind of surprising that Sega goes for another round on the Mini-console market on a system they did already, rather than doing a Mini for Master System or Saturn, but I guess the former doesn't have the same appeal/sales potential and the latter would require a far bigger investment to make the games play even semi-decently.

They said they looked into the Saturn, but the chipset they're using can't handle it, and due to the global parts shortage it wasn't feasible to try & go bigger right now.

The thing about the Master System I think most people don't realize is that it launched in Japan Oct 1985, but was quickly shunted into distant 3rd place irrelevance by the PC Engine's launch in 1987. Sega announced the Mega Drive the next summer in 1988, and discontinued the Master System/Mark III when the MD launched there in fall 1988.

So in Japan the Master System barely existed, it came & went in 36 months. It vanished before things like Wonder Boy III or Alex Kidd in Shinobi World were even developed. It actually had a shorter lifespan than the SG-1000, which at least managed to get nearly 4 years worth of games there. Game Gear, Mega CD, Dreamcast, everything Sega made had a longer Japanese lifespan except the 32X.

In North America it stumbled along for nearly 5 years, but according to SoA VP Shinobu Toyoda, the Master System never captured more than 6% of the market share there (they lied publicly and said 10% to try & save some kind of face). So it has zero nostalgia value there either.

Sega is obviously thinking Japan-first with these things, nobody else even knows what an Astro City is. So should they do a Master System mini? Heck yeah, give us all those Western games with their secret FM soundtracks available. Make turbo fire standard like it was on the Japanese MS. Let other regions check out Power Strike II, the late Disney games or even SF II. Include the 3D glasses, make every game compatible with them, and make the original games run smoothly. Put in a scaling algorithm for optional modes in Space Harrier, Galaxy Force or Outrun to make them the games people imagined they could be. Given how small the ROMs are and that a single person can code a reasonable game for it, give it a USB port and put out a simple dev tool to give it a hobbyist scene. There is so, so much cool stuff they could do with it.

But do I expect them to put one out? Not if they haven't released the Game Gear outside Japan, which would have made more sense and had a lower cost risk.

[xxx1993]

If only they could get Android Assault. That's the best Sega CD shmup.