19th Annual Top 25 Shmups of All Time - Discussion Thread*

[Nifty]

Voting

Discussion Thread

Hey people what's (shm)up

Another year has ticked over and it's time for that thing that happens here to happen again... with a small asterisk attached. My issue last time was participation, which appears to have stabilised (touch wood), now it's the realisation that I'm about to do this for the tenth time and sooner or later someone else is going to have to re-learn everything that I have. I never really intended for this to become "my" thing per se, I stepped in because I wanted to keep the T25 going and then it... kept going. It's also true that I would prefer having some of the time back nowadays, it takes up a lot of focus for ~two months and next December I'd rather feel like I'm planning for something else.

I'm fully aware that this is easier said than done, which is why I'm trying to get this in early. The process has its various idiosyncrasies that are going to remain pretty much regardless of how it's carried out, but ultimately the most important and complex part is the tallying up and scoring of the entries. I could let someone else handle the organising while I keep running the numbers, but the problem of someone eventually having to figure out how to do it their own way remains.

Basically what I want to propose is this: If there's someone(s) else who knows they should have the free time and who'd like to try and get the hang of organising and running this shindig, they can use this year's voting period to set up their own calculation system in their program/language of choice, and then run it in tandem with mine while I finalise the results, to see how much of a safe handle they've got on it and so they get an idea of how much work/time/fiddliness it will take. (I'd prefer any definite offers be set via PM initially, so I can further organise from there.) I'll discuss everything else as I go through, but this will be the major thing I want to see that someone else can do for the time being. Failing that, I will be taking next year off and maintaining bi-yearly runnings from then on.


No doubts about my commitment for the present though. Voting will proceed as normal, and I've even got a few bonus results planned once I'm done. There's been a surprising variety of releases over the last couple of years, inviting no shortage of entries to talk about or trains to jump aboard. If there are any games you've been waiting to try out properly or considered making room for, now's the time to get in and do it!


Past results:
18th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2020
17th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2019
16th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2018
15th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2017
14th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2016
13th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2015
12th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2014
11th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2013
10th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2012
9th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2010ish
8th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2009
7th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2008
6th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2007
5th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2006
4th Annual Top 25 Results: through 2005
3rd Annual Top 25 Results: through 2004
2nd Annual Top 25 Results: through 2003
Inaugural Top 25 Results: through 2002

To link directly to your ballot (or any other post):

1. On the post in question, look at the upper right where the date stamp is. (I hope this is consistent across all themes.)
2. Right-click on the little sheet of paper to the left of the Posted: text and copy the link address.
3. Make a link in your commentary post using that destination.

[Acid]

GG Aleste 3 about to get 25 points from me. Gundemonium Recollection and Hitogata Happa might be moving up too.

[PerishedFraud ឵឵]

I vote for Divine Sealing.

Join me. We can get it to the #1 spot it deserves.

[JJHLH]

Thank you Nifty for doing this.

Dangun Feveron will get my top vote, followed closely by ESP Ra De Psi.

1998 was a great year.

[To Far Away Times]

Best thread of the year. Thank you for doing this Nifty.

I think I'm going to approach my list differently this year. In the past I've used my previous lists and made changes around the edges. This year, I'll do one from scratch, which will hopefully lead to more variety and more new entries in my list. I really want to work in a few more console exclusive games from the 16-bit era, we'll see if it happens.

Also, Futari's taking it this year, right? And I'm really hoping Thunder Force III can climb in the ranks.

[Eyvah_Ehyeh]

Since people have started using this thread to promote their favorite shmups, I'm gonna propose everyone who hasn't tried out parsec47, to do so. Never understood if it wasn't popular due to it having few people who enjoyed playing it, or few people who actually ENJOYED playing it. Don't think parsec47 has ever been close to getting on the list, so let's make it happen this year!

[reckon luck]

voting is fun, people should do it.

[WeedyRainfall]

how in the FUCK did a year go by already

[Some-Mist]

I took a break from voting the last few years (2018, 2019, 2020) since I wasn't playing much, but I'm looking forward to voting again since I became more active last year.
I'll get progear back up into that list

[To Far Away Times]

Alright guys lets do this.

[Sengoku Strider]

Glad you stepped up to handle this again Nifty, I’ve been looking forward it. This has been the biggest year for shmup releases since maybe the 1980s, and it seems like there are a number of comparatively newer members here (myself included) who are getting to experience some of these re-releases for the first time. Not to mention the retro market booming with a lot of people obviously buying up shmups like crazy.

That being said, for all the new stuff I played this year that’s making my list (hardly shocking but I quickly fell in love with Ketsui), nothing knocked Gunbird 2 off the #1 perch I placed it on last year.

And I'm really hoping Thunder Force III can climb in the ranks.

I had TFAC in my top 10 last year (personally prefer AC to III). It's surprising to see it didn't make either the top 25 or the honourable mentions, given that it was a consistent resident at the top the list for many years.

[WeedyRainfall]

I will never understand the appeal of TF3. Maybe it's just that i have no nostalgia for it, but, i just don't get it. I've played through it on switch, and i just don't see what it's doing so well to be a top ten. Some games, like R-type, are just not for me, but i can see the appeal and understand what there is to like for other people. But TF3, IMHO, this game is butt ass trash IMHO.

Is there any other shmup that has ever gone from top 3 to not worth mentioning? How did that happen? It's kinda weird.

[PerishedFraud ឵឵]

TF3 has great music, really cool weapons, and some amazing moments in levels. (At the cost of the player being greatly overpowered)

It isn't a masterpiece. It isn't technically amazing. It doesn't have any great innovations. It isn't even a challenge.
Despite all of this it's consistently very fun to play. For fun. The placements, level balance, and weapons make it really, really satisfying to blast things in TF3. Did i mention it sounds great?


Hopefully that explains it.

Anyway vote Divine Sealing. It's gonna be great.

[To Far Away Times]

Yeah I think that sums it up very well.

There are more challenging games, there are better games for score, there are games that are more mechanically sound, but... Thunderforce III puts fun above all else. Eveything feels like it is designed around being as fun as possible. Easy enough to be a first 1CC if you want, but challenging enough to be a satsifying surivial experience. Player empowerment and great weapons. A memorable experience, and an absolutely legendary OST. There's a lot of games with that spirit in the 2002 list. Blazing Lazers and Soldier Blade come to mind as well. TF3 represents the pinnacle of that sort of game to me, but I think a lot of these older style consoles games have a ton of merit.

[PerishedFraud ឵឵]

Anyway, on a more serious topic, my vote will likely go for Out Zone. It's really friendly to new players, also has a kickass soundtrack, feels incredible once you master it, looks great too, etc. I can praise the game for ages and I think it's hard to walk away from it without having had fun. Plug here.

I've seen it on honorable mentions which gives me hope.

[EmperorIng]

I had TFAC in my top 10 last year (personally prefer AC to III). It's surprising to see it didn't make either the top 25 or the honourable mentions, given that it was a consistent resident at the top the list for many years.

The people that voted for TF3 tended to be people who played it when they were kids growing up with the Megadrive, so I imagine that simply the md boomers aren't as full force as they used to be, and there were less excellent shmups for them to play on console and mame.

[To Far Away Times]

That's our secret, we're all boomers here.

[Rastan78]

Also TF3 was an early release on Genesis. I think like a full year or so before even Sonic 1? A lot of people were still playing stuff like Castlevania 3, Mario 3 and later Mega Man games on NES around that time and not everyone had even seen 16 bit graphics at home yet. Magazines referred to it as a "graphical tour de force" at the time. Viewed in the context of that pre SF2, pre Streets of Rage and Sonic context you can better see how it would be melting brains in 1990 and gaining a good reputation.

[Sengoku Strider]

I had TFAC in my top 10 last year (personally prefer AC to III). It's surprising to see it didn't make either the top 25 or the honourable mentions, given that it was a consistent resident at the top the list for many years.

The people that voted for TF3 tended to be people who played it when they were kids growing up with the Megadrive, so I imagine that simply the md boomers aren't as full force as they used to be, and there were less excellent shmups for them to play on console and mame.

I didn't encounter it until the Sega AGES release on Switch. Perished & Far Away explained well what grabbed me about it. And the choonz, man. Is there a more kickin' shmup track than Hunger Made Them Desperate?

I didn't get a Mega Drive until last year. I got all three Thunder Forcen, thought they were all cool, understood why TF4 was held in such esteem, but still liked AC best.

Outside of those it was interesting to see what held up. I expected to love Musha Aleste as a big Compile fan, but it kind of underwhelmed me. Tatsujin I also always thought looked cool, but on playing it...ick. Those murder-checkpoints with a puny blaster were unbelievably punishing. Same!³ on the other hand is still really fun though. Very meat & potatoes, but fundamentally solid, nailed the classic chunky MD sound, & just a good time to pick up & blast stuff in. Makes me want to check out Twin Hawk.

Granada...couldn't quite figure what people saw in it. It's fine, but didn't seem like anything that transcended its era from as far as I've played it.

Gaiares is a yes. Gley Lancer I got through the Ratalaika release rather than dropping $400 on the cart, and I had a heck of a great time with that. Also got the Gynoug release...kinda middling, but I can see why people would click with that one.

Elemental Master seems ok, I haven't put enough time into that one yet TBH. Arrow Flash is a decent time, though perhaps not all time list material.

Still looking to get Super Fantasy Zone, Aero Blasters, Sagaia, and maybe someday Eliminate Down. But that was already stupid expensive and then got stupid expensiver over the past year.

[To Far Away Times]

Gairies leaves a great first impression but the last 2 levels have incredibly poor production values compared to the previous stages. Almost no new assets, poorly tiled background, no real thought to the stage design and a repetitive enemy, a reused boss rush that is there only to pad out the game... It's like a historic drop off. Would have been better to release an awesome five stage game than dump a seven stage one that ends on such a low point.

Gleylancer is awesome. One of the top Genny blasters, no doubt about it.

Elemental Master is pretty cool. Great tunes in that one. It's a very fun walk 'em up that I've played through several times, but maybe not quite essential playing.

Eliminate Down has a really neat first level but I've never been able to stick with it for some reason.

[WeedyRainfall]

Despite all of this it's consistently very fun to play. For fun. The placements, level balance, and weapons make it really, really satisfying to blast things in TF3. Did i mention it sounds great?

Gotta respectfully disagree with everything you said. I think the level design and balance is pretty bad. It's like, boring boring boring gotcha death boring boring boring lol gotcha again. There's nothing happening for long periods of time and then you get killed by something you have to memorize to dodge. It's horrible.

The sound is awful. All treble no bass. Sounds like it's being filtered through someone's nose. One of the things that really turned me off. It sounds really awful.

And the lava level is not impressive. Not even for the time. It looks really shitty. I do not understand how someone could be impressed by that. I had a SNES, lots of games looked waaaay better than this back then.

[WeedyRainfall]

That's our secret, we're all boomers here.

Yeah really seems like it. Kinda sucks.

Not exactly a recipe for a healthy, growing community lol

[PerishedFraud ឵឵]

jizz slap

[Sengoku Strider]

Despite all of this it's consistently very fun to play. For fun. The placements, level balance, and weapons make it really, really satisfying to blast things in TF3. Did i mention it sounds great?

Gotta respectfully disagree with everything you said. I think the level design and balance is pretty bad. It's like, boring boring boring gotcha death boring boring boring lol gotcha again. There's nothing happening for long periods of time and then you get killed by something you have to memorize to dodge. It's horrible.

The sound is awful. All treble no bass. Sounds like it's being filtered through someone's nose. One of the things that really turned me off. It sounds really awful.

And the lava level is not impressive. Not even for the time. It looks really shitty. I do not understand how someone could be impressed by that. I had a SNES, lots of games looked waaaay better than this back then.

1. Thunder Force III came out before the Super Nintendo did, even in Japan. If you want to compare it to its contemporaries, you're talking stuff like Darius II, Whip Rush, Truxton, Dragon Spirit, Forgotten Worlds, arcade Gradius III...the only games that were around at the time that I think go 10 rounds with it are R-Type & Blazing Lazers.

2. Funnily enough, the game was so successful it was ported to the arcade as Thunder Force AC - on hardware with more sound channels where it sounds notably better, which is why it's my preferred version. And then that version was further ported to the SNES as Thunder Spirits. A version which is pretty unanimously pegged as kinda bleh and sounding blech.

[PerishedFraud ឵឵ ឵឵]

Despite all of this it's consistently very fun to play. For fun. The placements, level balance, and weapons make it really, really satisfying to blast things in TF3. Did i mention it sounds great?

Gotta respectfully disagree with everything you said. I think the level design and balance is pretty bad. It's like, boring boring boring gotcha death boring boring boring lol gotcha again. There's nothing happening for long periods of time and then you get killed by something you have to memorize to dodge. It's horrible.

The sound is awful. All treble no bass. Sounds like it's being filtered through someone's nose. One of the things that really turned me off. It sounds really awful.

And the lava level is not impressive. Not even for the time. It looks really shitty. I do not understand how someone could be impressed by that. I had a SNES, lots of games looked waaaay better than this back then.

i like tyrian 2000

[Despatche]

The sound is awful. All treble no bass. Sounds like it's being filtered through someone's nose. One of the things that really turned me off. It sounds really awful.

Nah, this is just that "waaah Mega Drive sound is soooo 'tinny'" garbage you see all over the internet, get that outta here.

That aside, III's sound is better than AC's. Not sure they totally knew what they were doing there.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

i like tyrian 2000

Tyrian 2000 is an admirable shmup. Doesn't hold a candle to SideLine though, the king of MS-DOS shmups.

[PerishedFraud ឵឵]

I still can't believe Sideline ripped a tile from metroid. Jesus man. No shame!

[Herr Schatten]

This year, there are two new entries in my top 25.

The first is R-Type Final 2. I really didn't expect to enjoy this as much as I did (and still do). At first glance, it felt a little rough around the edges, but it really grew on me as I kept playing. The levels are very solidly designed, with none of the cinematic filler that plagued parts of RTF1. There's a good amount of variety due to the three different routes through the game, and it's a ton of fun to re-learn the stages with different ships and their unique sets of features. Additionally, the many difficulty settings offer something for everyone, ranging from a casual cruise to a true arcade experience. The homage stages are nice bonuses and fun diversions, even though I generally find them less compelling than the game's main courses.

The second one is Sisters Royale, another game that has much more to offer than it first seems. From watching videos of it, I originally mistook it for a "lesser" Shikigami-no-Shiro-type of game, but when I started actually playing it, I found out that this impression was quite wrong. The game follows the template set by SnS II closely, but it's not so much a stripped-down but rather a condensed version of it. The game does away with most of the new gameplay elements from SnS III and reduces the number of characters considerably, probably to make sure they play sufficiently differently. The action is a little more zoomed-in, which makes the game feel a little more claustrophobic. I'm not a huge fan of the stage gimmicks (ice patches, fans, etc.), but those are just minor irritations in an otherwise excellent game. In fact, I would recommend this to newcomers who want to try this style of gameplay over any of the original SnS games, as it's so much more accessible. The game's very generous with bombs and extends, so a 1CC isn't the most difficult thing to achieve. However, once you start playing for score, a whole new dimension of the game opens up and it becomes very, very addictive. Many thanks to EmperorIng for tirelessly recommending this game. I don't know if I had given it a due chance otherwise.

[reckon luck]

my votes

New this year:
Varth
Forgotten Worlds
Giga Wing
Akashicverse
Nova Drift

Capcom Arcade Stadium brought the biggest shakeup and I almost added more from it. I'm expecting the Astro City Mini V is going to do the same next year, some big guns there that I haven't spent much time on.