Any home console port of arcade shmups worth it ?

[Liquidus0]

Hey everyone !

I am thinking of selling a couple of dozen of 8/16 bits era shmups from my collection. All of them being ports of arcade shmups. Like Sonic Wings on SF, Grind Stormer, Truxton and Zero Wing on MD or Armed Formation F, Dragon Spirit and Ordyne on PC Engine.

I realized 2 things :

I almost never give them attention as I have 30 shmups arcade PCB and I come back to them most of the time.

and

I participate to friendly shmup scoring competitions and it is always the arcade version that is played. I am starting to like more playing an emulated arcade version of a shmup than a console port.

My question here : Are any 8/16 bits era arcade shmup console port worth keeping ? Being different enough or improved from the original arcade version ?

The only one I can think about is Atomic Runner Chelnov on MD.

I'm eager to read you guys !

[pablumatic]

An interesting port for me is Area 88/UN Squadron for the SFC/SNES. It’s somewhat of a totally different game from the arcade version. A bit RPG-ish in that you can use money to buy new planes which have different abilities. So there can be some “grinding” involved to get the best equipment. You also get to choose levels. Graphics are a little downgraded and the last stage is totally different from the arcade game.

Super R-Type for the SFC/SNES drops some of the arcade stages from R-type II but adds three of its own unique ones. I wouldn’t call it better however.

I generally prefer arcade versions of arcade shooters, but I don’t mind some older console ports now and then.

[EmperorIng]

Having played around with a number of shmups from the 16bit era, most of the time the arcade version comes out on top. However there are exceptions where I find the ports more enjoyable, playable, or improved upon than the originals. Most of these are on the PC Engine (truth be told I ignore almost the entirety of the 8bit shmup console library as well).

e.g. Cotton on the PC Engine, on top of having better music (arranges of the arcade original), feels a bit better to play and less stiff/awkward than the arcade game. Game feels generally rebalanced to be a little easier, but still contains a tough second loop for those wanting a challenge. Note that a new Cotton remake -based off the superior X68000 remake- is coming out next month (apparently, on consoles and steam too) so that having the PCE CD version may end up being superfluous.

Gradius II on the PCE CD is also a game that can be arguably considered better, but that might be a tough claim considering how legendary the ac original is. If nothing else the fine-tuning of the hitboxes, the lovely redbook audio, and the new exclusive stage make it a worthy complement to the ac game.

I might throw in Detana Twinbee here on the pce hucard but that's only because it feels a bit more fair than the insanity of the arcade game's difficulty, and has less moments of absurd hitbox hilarity that sometimes crop up in my Saturn Deluxe Pack. It does cut out a level from the game and the graphical hit (and lack of parallax) are unmistakeable, so often I go back to the arcade game for the full experience anyway.

Super Darius II on the PCE CD is an entirely new game wearing the title of Darius II, with all new bosses and stages for the most part, so it becomes eminently worthwhile as a consolized take on the brutal arcade game.

Hellfire MD and Zero Wing MD are arguably better than the arcade originals. The former because of the additions that Toaplan added to rebalance and reshape the game (adding checkpoints, an option for the hellfire ship, a bomb), and the latter for removing the god-awful red flash whenever you kill an enemy in the arcade game. Both have better music (though Hellfire only plays at the correct speed on a model 1 genesis).

[WarpedByTheNHK]

The Mega Drive version of Fire Shark which is also often considered superior than the arcade original because the difficulty was toned down enough that you don't have to memorize every pixel of the game just to have a chance lol. Also, it is enough easier that recovery actually feels somewhat reasonable despite the fact that you still lose all of your power and speed upon death.

[MachineAres 1CC]

It's true what some people said here, that many times the home ports are different enough (and better) that they're worth keeping around, and that comparing to the arcade version is sometimes moot.

Though, it's also true that you need to consider if you want to play the arcade version of a certain game, if there is not proper home port of the arcade version, you have to ask yourself how OK you are with playing it on an emulator or if you're ok with paying hundreds or thousands of dollars to obtain the actual PCB. Modern arcade emulation through ShmupMAME or ShmupArch has gotten close enough that some of the top players in the world use it instead of PCBs, so that's also a thing.

Nowadays we're thankfully getting tons of ports on modern consoles that are 1:1 arcade ports (or very close) through the Arcade Archives, ShotTriggers, or just on the 360/PS4 in general, which makes many arcade shmups more accessible, so depending on what you're looking to play, there's various ways to go about it. Unfortunately, I none of the games you mentioned in your post have any modern ports since they're mostly pretty obscure, all things considered, so emulation might be your best option.

If you do happen to find that a game you want to buy a PCB of does have a modern port, you can always go that route as well, and plenty of us here can help with your research into which ports might fit what you're looking for and which ones are close enough to suffice instead of buying a PCB

Naturally, if you don't already have a 360 or PS4, you'd have to buy the console (though the cost of those is pretty minimal right now, easily under $150 for either) plus an arcade stick (a great quality one can also can be had for around $100 or less) but I'd say that's generally a lot better than paying the $500-2000 for *each game* that many arcade PCBs can cost now.

Fire Shark which is also often considered superior than the arcade original because the difficulty was toned down enough that you don't have to memorize every pixel of the game just to have a chance lol. Also, it is enough easier that recovery actually feels somewhat reasonable despite the fact that you still lose all of your power and speed upon death.

Perfect example here. I just 1CC'd the MD version of Fire Shark a few days ago, and it's so much more of an enjoyable experience overall.

[TransatlanticFoe]

Obligatory mention of the 4:3 crash zoom BOOM hellscape that is the Mega Drive port of Kyukyoku Tiger/Twin Cobra.

Not sure if it's intentional but with no room to manoeuvre plus the BOOM explosions dialled up to 11, it's intense and satisfying.

[pablumatic]

Neo Geo CD versions of Last Resort, Viewpoint, and Pulstar have CD soundtracks that their arcade counterparts did not. You get a bit of CD loading times with them, of course, but otherwise they look and play the same as their arcade brethren.

[To Far Away Times]

I like Gradius III and Darius II's 16 bit ports better than their arcade originals.

Gradius III is pretty well known so I won't tread old water here.

Darius II on the Sega Genesis is a really nice version of that game. Feels like a director's cut in a lot of ways. The game is completely rebuilt around a single 4:3 screen and everything is adjusted accordingly. That alone makes it better, but it also doesn't have the weirdness of the arcade version's difficulty balancing. In the arcade version, you can't even get the powerup levels in the attract mode. They must have screwed with the difficulty late in development or something similar. Darius II for Genesis has a pretty nice difficulty curve. Not too hard, not too easy. It's secretly way better than it's arcade original.

[Liquidus0]

Thank you all for you answers so far ! It helped me seeing things differently for some of them and will keep 3 or 4 that I was planning to sell initially.

I should mention I got pickier over the year when it comes to older shmups (early '90s and older). It's not an era that I go back often.

I'll still sell most of the ones I mentioned as I tend to keep what I think I'll play someday.

I sold many games over the last years, but I never sold shmups in my collection so far. I had over 5500 games a couple of years ago, now I am more around 2500. I still have over 300 shmups (not counting sub-genre).

To lean my collection is one of the best move I ever did. I'm confident it'll be the good this to do by selling some shmups as well.

[OmegaFlareX]

I love FC Salamander. Way better than AC. Although it's not just a port, I suppose. Salamander PCE is more straight-forward but improves on some of AC's shortcomings like hitboxes.

Tatsujin PCE, Daisenpu PCE (HuCard), Zero Wing MD, Dangerous Seed MD, Slap Fight MD, and DonPachi Saturn/PS1 all have better music than arcade. Midnight Resistance MD gets an honorable mention for being a run-n-gun.

[StrzxgvNuvWvfld]

PCE Salamander is the first thing I thought of. It fixes some of the issues from the arcade (no more hiding in the corner waiting for the stage 5 boss to time out!), adds restart points on death and I think generally feels like a nice remix of the arcade version. It's arguably better than the arcade, but at the very least different enough to stand on its own.

[professor ganson]

An interesting topic. Some years ago I sold a bunch of my console games to get PCBs. I ultimately got frustrated with fragility and storage issues, so I went back to the console games. I'm really happy with my decision, and have been loving the PCE shmups above all.

EmperorIng's post above was really nice. I'll add that the PCE CD-ROM's Hyper Dyne Side Arms Special is something I've enjoyed quite a bit. The special "BC" version of the game is worth the price by itself, imo.

I recently picked up the PCE version of 1943 Kai, and it seems like they put a lot of care into it. I believe it has some original content as well, but I haven't gotten far into it. And then way too pricey is the 1941: Counter Attack on SuperGrafx. I hear this is great, but I haven't been able to justify spending so much.

[FRO]

I've spoken to this before, in another thread (don't remember which one). The short version is, it's really dependent on a game-by-game basis. I think even the worst console ports still have some merit, because they can be held up as examples of what NOT to do when porting a game, or examples of bad design, etc. Those games are worth playing long enough to really understand why they're bad, and hopefully come away with a greater appreciation for what makes the good games actually good. And yes, there are examples of games that play relatively close to the arcade version, mechanically, but don't quite match up with it. Those are still worth a look, if only to compare and contrast between the arcade original and the ports, to see what sacrifices were made, what changed, and maybe get insight into what works better on console, as opposed to on arcade hardware. There are a handful of examples of games that were arguably improved (in some facets) on home consoles, such as 1943 on NES, or UN Squadron on SNES, where the game's core ideas were expanded upon, and you get more depth out of the experience. Overall, though, I think home ports are still well worth spending the time to check them out. You may find that you enjoy a home port more than the arcade, or that a particular console has a "sound" you like, moreso than what you get from the arcade. At the end of the day, it's still somewhat subjective.

[MintyTheCat]

EmperorIng's post above was really nice. I'll add that the PCE CD-ROM's Hyper Dyne Side Arms Special is something I've enjoyed quite a bit. The special "BC" version of the game is worth the price by itself, imo.

You just reminded me of the Saturn's port of Hyper-Duel as it has the Saturn mode added.

I recently picked up the PCE version of 1943 Kai, and it seems like they put a lot of care into it. I believe it has some original content as well, but I haven't gotten far into it. And then way too pricey is the 1941: Counter Attack on SuperGrafx. I hear this is great, but I haven't been able to justify spending so much.

I shall have a look - the artwork for 1943 kai always appealed to me but I never tried it.

[Gamer707b]

I dunno, but I'm partial to 16 shooters. Especially the good ones. I still would keep them even if they are "inferior" to the arcade versions. I like their charm. BUT, if I had a couple thousand games like the OP, I might very well want to thin my collection too. Man, you had 5000 games? That's a shitload dude. I thought I over did it. I have 400ish. I only buy games I know will get a lot of play and don't really take chances on buying games I'm not sure about anymore.

[scrilla4rella]

As others have said, it's really a case-by-case basis. Depends a lot on what your favs are.

Surprised no one has mentioned Slap Fight on MD yet. One of the best on the Sega Mega Drive (one of the best consoles for STGs next to PCE and Saturn- the holly trinity of shmup consoles). Amazing music with top-tier arrange by Yuzo Koshiro. Game has two distinct modes. Better than the arcade, from what I can tell. I'm also partial to Kyukyoku Tiger on PCE, even though the arcade version kicks all kinds of ass.

Edit: Bastugun and Hyper Duel are also nice to have on Saturn for the convenience of having their respective OG and Special versions on each disk. 1944 Kai on PCE (reprogrammed by Naxat Soft) is also a personal GOAT

[Marc]

Time has dulled my memories, but I'm pretty certain I much preferred PCE Kyukyoku Tiger on PCE back in the day. I remember Gradius looking and sounding nicer, and Salamander was nowhere near as janky as the arcade.