What gamepad are you using for PC and Switch shmups?

[Rastan78]

Yeah since the issue is QC it seems to be hit or miss. Some people say they got 2 8bitdos and one is perfect and the other had issues. I'll probably give in and pick one up sooner or later.

[bigbadboaz]

The pattern I've seen more is that certain models are confirmed bad, others seem to have better contact layout on the PCB internally. For example, the original SNES30 that put them on the map is notorious for Dpad inaccuracy. The SN30 they released later for the Classic, though, is pretty darn good. Oh, and their BT implementation is definitely much laggier than their 2.4Gs.

I'd pick a model that nobody seems to complain about, then maybe order two from someplace like Amazon where you can return. Return one if there's variance between them, or return both worst case. :/

[daphnid]

Has anyone been using the 'disco ball' d-pad on the Xbox Elite? I've been using a PS4 pad forever and got a 2.4ghz Saturn about a year ago, and they are both great, but I picked an Xbox Elite 2 controller a few days ago and tried the weird factory installed d-pad thinking it was a gimmick and am now absolutely in love with it.

[BrianC]

I haven't used it, but it does remind me a slight bit of the first US Saturn gamepad. That pad looks like it would be terrible, but it's actually not bad at all. Still prefer the JP and later US pads, though.

[MidnightWolf]

PowerA Fusion wired 6-button Fightpad

https://www.powera.com/p/fusion/control ... 509987-01/

It is based on the SEGA Saturn controller and has a floating D-pad that is truly amazing. I use it for absolutely everything. Also has a detachable USB cable with one of them "anti-tangle" braided cords.

[Creamy Goodness]

I feel less bad now with the issues I have had with my 8bitdo Pro. 90% of the time it works, but in those other instances I have to press the d-pad a few times before my input registers. Although not sure I can place the blame squarely on 8bitdo as apparently the Switch in general has dodgy bluetooth.

[daphnid]

I haven't used it, but it does remind me a slight bit of the first US Saturn gamepad. That pad looks like it would be terrible, but it's actually not bad at all. Still prefer the JP and later US pads, though.

Having never actually used a Saturn, when I got the Retrobit Saturn pad it felt like garbage upon immediate impression but in practice it feels great, although after an hour of sweaty practice with it my hands start to cramp up.

The Elite pad is indeed very Saturn-like, but so much more solid and the controller is overall much more ergonomic. Proper triggers help immensely as well, esp for hypers in Crimzon Clover and DFK etc. The disco ball is inferior to the 'cross' pad for literally every other application I've tried though lol.

[Jonpachi]

I feel less bad now with the issues I have had with my 8bitdo Pro. 90% of the time it works, but in those other instances I have to press the d-pad a few times before my input registers. Although not sure I can place the blame squarely on 8bitdo as apparently the Switch in general has dodgy bluetooth.

No, it's the controller. 8bitdo controllers are really hit-or-miss, especially when it comes to d-pads. I've used them on a variety of consoles and many of their products have the same issue of missed or incorrect inputs (accidental diagonals, etc).

[m.sniffles.esq]

For Switch, the wired Hori pro-controller is actually really awesome. I though I would hate it due to the removable d-pad, but in practice, it's awesome. Second only to the Saturn.

Om the other hand, the wireless Hori pro controller's d-pad is fucking terrible.

[BrianC]

I haven't used it, but it does remind me a slight bit of the first US Saturn gamepad. That pad looks like it would be terrible, but it's actually not bad at all. Still prefer the JP and later US pads, though.

Having never actually used a Saturn, when I got the Retrobit Saturn pad it felt like garbage upon immediate impression but in practice it feels great, although after an hour of sweaty practice with it my hands start to cramp up.

The Elite pad is indeed very Saturn-like, but so much more solid and the controller is overall much more ergonomic. Proper triggers help immensely as well, esp for hypers in Crimzon Clover and DFK etc. The disco ball is inferior to the 'cross' pad for literally every other application I've tried though lol.

I was referring to the early US Saturn pads that have a different dpad from JP and later US pads. It's an oddity rather than a standard dpad, but in practice it's not a bad dpad. Also, retro-bit Saturn pads can be hit or miss. Early ones had dpads that broke easily and mushy triggers, while later ones have better triggers, but some have other issues like buttons getting stuck. There were issues with the dpad breaking on the BT Saturn controllers too.

[Steven]

No, it's the controller. 8bitdo controllers are really hit-or-miss, especially when it comes to d-pads. I've used them on a variety of consoles and many of their products have the same issue of missed or incorrect inputs (accidental diagonals, etc).

Yeah, 8BitDo is... I'd call them trash, but that would be insulting to trash, which is moderately more useful than the typical 8BitDooDoo d-pad. That said, the M30 2.4g is amazing. It only really works on the Genesis/MD/Master System/probably Mark III, and PC and MiSTer when wired, but it's damn excellent.

I recently got the Retro-Bit Saturn Bluetooth controller for the Switch last week and it seems fine so far. I also have the 2.4GHz version, but it seems the Bluetooth version is more useful, as it lets you actually have the proper Genesis/MD/Saturn button layout for those games. This mode unfortunately puts L and R on X and Y and puts ZL and ZR on the actual L and R buttons, so its usefulness is limited by that, but it's good overall.

[BrianC]

Hopefully, the issue was fixed, but the dpad on my retrobit Saturn bluetooth controller started malfunctioning (some reviewers on Amazon mentioned similar issues). Frustrating thing is that it had a nice feel to it before it stopped working. I still use the Genesis BT pads with switch, which have the dpad raised slightly too high, but otherwise work great.

I like 8bitdo's 2.4G controllers better than their BT. I like the M30, and the 2.4G SN30 (both for SNES mini and SNES) and N30 quite a bit and haven't had issues with the dpads of those controllers (I did have issues with the dpad of the BT SN30s that were marketed with the Super NT, but no issues with other SNES style controllers from them, aside from the opposite issue with the earlier model SN30 Pro being too stiff). One of their SNES style BT controllers (SN30 Pro, IIRC) did have an odd input issue where some inputs couldn't be pressed at the same time, or something along those lines, though.

IIRC, the 8bitdo and krikzz MD controllers work with the Atari 7800 through the edladdin adapter for using a genesis controller as a 7800 controller. IMO, one of the best ways to play 2 button 7800 games (there are some nice custom controllers available too). Genesis controllers have a much nicer feel than the "Pro-Line" controllers.

[Steven]

I hope the d-pad on my Saturn controller doesn't break. The 2.4GHz version has been fine since I got it like 2 years ago or whenever it was that they released, so hopefully neither of them die.

8BitDo just makes junk with several notable exceptions. They are a very strange company and I have no idea why people like them at all. M30 2.4g is one of the absolute best controllers I have ever used, but their fake Nintendo controllers include the absolute worst controllers I've ever used. I have like 6 of their controllers: M30 2.4g (go buy it if you don't have one!), whatever that one that comes with the Nt mini Noir is called (it functions adequately, but it's nothing special), 2 SN30s (irredeemable garbage), SN30 Pro (irredeemable garbage), and the N30 Pro (massive bonus points for Japanese Mega Drive color scheme, but otherwise irredeemable garbage).

Also, why the fuck is everything they make called some variant of N30? Which one is which? I don't know, and I doubt anyone else remembers either without actually seeing a picture of the controller in question. I had to go research just to find the name of the now-discontinued N30 Pro just to type this post! Not a good naming convention, I think.

Still, that M30 2.4g is great and every Mega Drive/Genesis owner should try it if they have any interest at all in a wireless controller. If the rest of their 2.4g versions are better than the Bluetooth versions, that's reassuring, but the only other one I've used is that Nt mini Noir one, and it doesn't inspire me with enough confidence to try any more of their fake Nintendo controllers.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

I picked up a Mayflash Magic NS USB adapter for my Switch recently, you plug it into the dock, press and hold the button on it to cycle the mode until it flashes red so it's in Switch mode, then you can plug most USB controllers into it and it'll be recognized. I'm currently using a Hori Xbox360 stick on it, it's amazing. No noticeable latency.

The only downside is the Switch's interface refuses to let you remap the buttons, so if you're playing a game where you want to remap the controls because the defaults may suck your controller or stick's button layout (the stuff in the NES / SNES emulator for instance, which irritatingly doesn't support button remapping in the emulator) you're out of luck and have to physically move the buttons around in your stick. But this is more a fault of the Switch and of devs who refuse to implement basic control remapping.

[SPM]

the Switch's interface refuses to let you remap the buttons

You can remap the buttons Roo! Not for individual games for some reason, but you can have 5 different setups.

Spoiler

[Steven]

the Switch's interface refuses to let you remap the buttons

You can remap the buttons Roo! Not for individual games for some reason, but you can have 5 different setups.

Spoiler

You can only do that with some controllers, most likely only official Nintendo ones.

[SPM]

I do it with the 8bitdo arcade stick. It shows on the Switch as if it were the pro controler. Isn't that the case for every 3rd party controller?

[Steven]

I do it with the 8bitdo arcade stick. It shows on the Switch as if it were the pro controler. Isn't that the case for every 3rd party controller?

I know it does not work on the Retro-Bit Saturn 2.4GHz controller. I just checked and it does seem to work on the Bluetooth version, so for some controllers it works, but not others.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

You can remap the buttons Roo!

Sorry, this is my fault for being unclear. I already use the remapping interface for supported controllers for games that don't allow native in-game remapping. But, for some reason, the Switch refuses to allow certain controllers to take advantage of this remapping interface. When I have my stick plugged in through the Magic NS, it detects it as a USB device but the Change Button Mapping screen gives me a message that says something to the effect of "this controller can't be remapped". I can take a photo of the exact message later if you're curious.

I don't know which other controllers are denied remapping like this or what determines it, but yeah, as Steven says it's only doable with some controllers (namely the joycons and Nintendo Pro Controller at least).

As a side note, it's also kinda silly you can only save a measly 5 presets. I currently use two: one for remapping for the NES/SNES emulator so my thumb can be over Y and B together, and one for remapping Bayonetta 1's lock-on button to ZL instead of R. It's nice that the system offers this option, but really, developers need to have robust in-game remapping, it's not that hard to implement. I've been replaying Shadow of the Colossus and its layout is very sensible, shows you the default original button, and what you've remapped it to.

[Rastan78]

Normally the Switch allows you to remap buttons and save presets in the system OS. Is this some oddity of pairing with the converter?

I might have to pick one of these up if the latency isn't bad since I have an old 360 stick modded with an LS-32 and Sanwa buttons laying around. Then again maybe a brook universal board would be better?

As far as D pads I picked up the hori split pad pro for portable mode. The d pad is great. I had sort of held off on trying it as I was put off by the size. It does really transform the switch into sort of a beast, but it's totally worth it once you adjust.

Hori seems to be one of the only companies that can still produce great cross style D pads. Even Nintendo lost their touch.

Edit: ah now I see your clarification above. Weird that it doesn't work with all controllers.

Anyone happen to know if the Switch button remapping presets work with the 8bitdo M30 Genesis style pad?

[Steven]

Yeah, it's really weird that only some controllers can be remapped. I don't have many controllers that actually work on the Switch, though, just the regular Nintendo Pro controller, the 2 Retro-Bit Saturn controllers, and the Retro-Bit Genesis 2.4GHz controller, which is basically the exact same thing as the Saturn controller. Honestly I think the Retro-Bit Saturn Bluetooth controller is probably the single best wireless controller you can get for the Switch if you just want to play 2D games. According to the MiSTer lag database, the BT version somehow has less lag than the 2.4GHz version. Not sure how that works out and maybe it only applies to the MiSTer and not the Switch as well, but it is certainly interesting.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

As promised, here's a photo of what I'm seeing:

Normally the Switch allows you to remap buttons and save presets in the system OS. Is this some oddity of pairing with the converter?

That's kind of what I assumed it was. I hadn't heard of Change Button Mappings only working with certain controllers before until I encountered it.

I might have to pick one of these up if the latency isn't bad since I have an old 360 stick modded with an LS-32 and Sanwa buttons laying around.

I was extremely skeptical about these since I was worried about latency, but it's honestly been one of my best gaming purchases. I hate all the D-Pads on official Nintendo controllers for shmupping on Switch (Pro Controller hits diagonals too easily, doesn't have the hard clickiness of the Xbox One controller), and this has been an absolute lifesaver. Incredibly useful for only 25 bucks or so. I didn't notice any extra latency whatsoever, which is both absurd and delightful. Kudos to Mayflash. I mostly use it for the Aleste Collection and it feels like at most it's 2-3 frames input lag in total, if that, and it doesn't feel like there's any additional input lag compared to using a Nintendo controller (it's hard to judge how many frames it takes to register but it's definitely responsive, not what I'd call laggy by any means).

[BrianC]

I'm guessing the only difference with the magic NS 2 is support for bluetooth audio? I noticed a new 8bitdo BT adapter came out around the same time, which I assume is for the same reason?

[Jonpachi]

Not really the thread for this, but wanted to share that I picked up one of those Power A fighting pads for PS4 hoping to use it on the PS5 and got an error message saying "This controller cannot be used to play PS5 games." Such stupid shit. It lets me navigate the menus fine, but locks it out once the game starts...

[BareKnuckleRoo]

That reminds me of the time I had a rented copy of Star Wars Battlefront for the PS2. I tried using a PS1 Analog controller, and it refused to work with the controller, displaying an error message that a DUALSHOCK 2 controller was required. Apparently other people have reported the same issue with a Madcatz branded PS2 controller:

https://gamefaqs.gamespot.com/boards/92 ... i/40562945

https://www.reddit.com/r/ps2/comments/i ... says_this/

There is, of course, no sensible reason the game would require a Sony branded Dualshock 2 controller; the game was not reliant on the pressure sensitive capabilities of the Dualshock 2 (which were horrendously flakey and not used by sensible developers anyways).

edit:

I managed to find a list of games that allow for and that deny the use of PS1 analog controllers here, there's some weird oddities in the denied list:

https://www.ps2onlinegaming.com/viewtopic.php?t=181

Fatal Frame
Taito Legends
Tales of Legendia

I can think of no sensible reason for these to demand a Dualshock 2. None of them use pressure sensitivity that I'm aware of (and even if they did it'd be a bad move).

Grand Theft Auto: San Andreas

The game unfortunately uses the pressure sensitive functions on the face button for vehicle acceleration and it works about as well as you'd expect (badly). It's one reason I prefer the Xbox version over it, that uses the right trigger for acceleration which works a lot better. Previous GTA games have used digital inputs for vehicles and it's worked fine, so why they didn't also allow for this possibility is beyond me.

One game I see absent on the list I know for sure unfortunately uses the pressure sensitive face buttons is Star Ocean 3: Till the End of Time. And it uses them for exactly one stupid puzzle in the game where you have to play musical tunes, and to pick which of the 4 you play you use two face buttons, each playing one of two depending on if you press it lightly or press it hard. It's really finicky and awful, and straight up worse than if they'd simply mapped 4 different buttons or let you pick which to play from a quick pop-up menu.

The Dualshock 2 pressure sensitive face buttons are unbearable and I'm extremely grateful to all the PS2 games that sensibly ignored them (or ditched their use in sequels, SH2's melee controls are clunky due to using the pressure sensitivity whereas Silent Hill 3 has much improved melee attack controls that don't use the pressure sensitivity).

[Rastan78]

That's a total dick move by Sony to limit PS4 controller compatability on PS5. One area where Microsoft has them beat. No doubt they could update the firmware in a heartbeat to change this.

[Rastan78]

The Dualshock 2 pressure sensitive face buttons are unbearable and I'm extremely grateful to all the PS2 games that sensibly ignored them (or ditched their use in sequels, SH2's melee controls are clunky due to using the pressure sensitivity whereas Silent Hill 3 has much improved melee attack controls that don't use the pressure sensitivity).

Maybe you should switch to playing on arcade stick?

[BareKnuckleRoo]

I don't know what this abomination is and I hate that it exists.

[Rastan78]

Lol it's the original version of Street Fighter 1 that used pressure sensitive hit pads. It was quickly replaced bc it sucked and led to the six button config that everybody knows and loves.

Imagine an alternate reality where that's what caught on and every self respecting FGC guy needed to have a massive 2 button pneumatic fight stick.

[BareKnuckleRoo]

That's wild. I never knew about that.

Imagine an alternate reality where that's what caught on and every self respecting FGC guy needed to have a massive 2 button pneumatic fight stick.

That's terrifying.