M2 Toaplan collection

This is the main shmups forum. Chat about shmups in here - keep it on-topic please!
User avatar
hamfighterx
Posts: 558
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2010 5:45 pm
Location: Bonus Round

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by hamfighterx »

DenimDemon wrote:I think these games are making me a better player lol! Just booted up Raiden and blast it till stage 4! At my first try! Hadn’t played for a while. Raiden sniper tanks are nothing compared with Same! Ahahaha then played a bit of Thunder Dragon 2, what a sweet gentle game. Ahahah the pain in the collection is real! No pain no gain [FLEXED BICEPS]
LMAO yeah, after playing mostly Same! (with some Hishouzame and KyuTiger mixed in) for the past couple weeks, I fired up Esp.ra.de today and wow the difference was striking. I felt like I was seeing things in slow motion, Matrix style. Of course, a lot of that is me not being terribly good at the more memory-heavy Toaplan games (or, at least not experienced enough to have the levels really burned into my brain)... but when it comes to improvising and reactions, any practice I was getting with Same when forced to try to dodge has certainly honed my skills for less brutal games.

I can only imagine what's going to happen when I fall down a Tatsujin Ou hole some time in the future and then switch to ANYTHING else.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

Holy

shit

All your signature are belong to me: https://imgur.com/a/NapNUd9

Uemura-san is probably the coolest dude I've ever met. He has great energy and deep passion for his games and his music. I am very glad that I got to hang out with him and talk about Toaplan with him and he even played Kyuukyoku Tiger 2P version with me on the Switch... yeah, we totally sucked and credit fed our way through stage 1, but it was still great. He put up with all of my stupid questions, signed every single one of my Toaplan games that he worked on without hesitation, he All Your Based my English Retro-Bit Zero Wing when I asked him to, and he would have signed all of the ones he didn't work on as well.

Live setlist:

announcer voice: "All your base are belong to us!"
Fire Shark
Hellfire 2014
Dogyuun Magic
Tsugaru
helicopter sound effects -> Break a Leg!
New Day for Me, and New Day for You 2021
Tatsujin wo Koete Ou to Nare (BRAVE MAN ~ FAR AWAY ~ LIVE IN FUTURE)

Yeah, that shit was fucking amazing.

I didn't talk to Sato-san as much since I haven't played but like 2 games that he's worked on, but he's a cool dude and he signed my Thunder Force VI. When I asked him what games of his that he'd want me to play, he said Raiden III and IV, so I'm going to try those. Also met the dude who did the music for Space Manbow and one of the guys who worked on Cotton Rock 'n' Roll, who I'd actually met before at Mikado last month, so it was cool to meet him again and talk to him again.

Anyway, yeah, I never thought I'd play Kyuukyoku Tiger with someone who literally made the game. Good shit, M2. There were a few other people from Toaplan there as well, but they left immediately once U-Brand's show was over and I didn't get to talk to them.
User avatar
DenimDemon
Posts: 315
Joined: Sun May 02, 2021 6:15 pm

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by DenimDemon »

Wow thats cool! Envy you! Any more photos?:)
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

Nah, not on my side. Uemura-san has some pictures of us playing Kyuukyoku Tiger together, though. Man we really really sucked incredibly badly lol. We both game overed like 5 times each. Playing it in 2P mode is a completely different experience from even playing the 2P version alone.
User avatar
brentsg
Posts: 2303
Joined: Sun Jul 12, 2009 9:01 pm
Location: St. Louis, MO USA

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by brentsg »

I'm sure the answer is in this thread but I haven't located it.

The PS4 version of the latest collection had 2 DLC codes. One for bonus games and one for Teki Paki.

Does the Switch version have only the Teki Paki code?
Breaking news: Dodonpachi Developer Cave Releases Hello Kitty Game
User avatar
BIL
Posts: 18989
Joined: Thu May 10, 2007 12:39 pm
Location: COLONY

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by BIL »

Steven wrote:Holy

shit

All your signature are belong to me: https://imgur.com/a/NapNUd9
Great read bud, thanks for posting :smile:
User avatar
DenimDemon
Posts: 315
Joined: Sun May 02, 2021 6:15 pm

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by DenimDemon »

brentsg wrote:I'm sure the answer is in this thread but I haven't located it.

The PS4 version of the latest collection had 2 DLC codes. One for bonus games and one for Teki Paki.

Does the Switch version have only the Teki Paki code?
Yeah the Switch physical only has the code for Teki Paki. Other dlc is included in the cart.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

BIL wrote:
Steven wrote:Holy

shit

All your signature are belong to me: https://imgur.com/a/NapNUd9
Great read bud, thanks for posting :smile:
Sure, no problem!

There are so many things I wanted to ask him... every day since then I think "damn, I wish I had asked him about (thing)" or "damn, I was planning to ask him about (thing) but I forgot". I have a very strong feeling that we will meet again, though, and I hope we do.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

Something that I have been wondering about for months now: what's the deal with Teki-Paki's leaderboards? There's arcade and then there's infinity, but then the thing on the screen tells me that my ranking type is arcade/infinity. Am I both at the same time? If so, why are there separate leaderboards for them and what's the difference?

lol never mind; 10 seconds later and I've figured it out; arcade goes to the arcade counterstop and infinity continues past the arcade counterstop.
bigbadboaz
Posts: 1135
Joined: Mon Feb 14, 2005 4:08 am
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by bigbadboaz »

Steven, did I miss this or.. HOW did you meet those guys?
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

bigbadboaz wrote:Steven, did I miss this or.. HOW did you meet those guys?
I went to this: https://club.goodman2020.com/events/6666
User avatar
SPM
Posts: 452
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:04 pm

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by SPM »

Idk where I should ask this, so maybe here:

In Tiger Heli the bonus cars seem to appear if the player has shot a multiple of 16 shots up to their spawning points.

Destroying every enemy and structure with a single shot up to the first bonus car requires exactly 16 shots. So my question is... Are the rest of the bonus positions designed around using just the necessary shots, or would you have to count them/get lucky? (or watch the gadget that counts them XD)
"There are three possible endings: the good one, the bad one and death" - Locomalito, Super Hydorah
User avatar
Jeneki
Posts: 2501
Joined: Wed Aug 12, 2009 4:56 pm
Location: Minnesota, USA

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Jeneki »

I think counting would become impossible at that red tower where you mash for points. So yeah, just the first car (or use the gadget).
Typos caused by cat on keyboard.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

I typically end up either wasting bombs or getting killed from hitting 16 shots and not shooting every time I try to get those bonus cars. That video I posted a while ago where I got a game over due to being insta-sniped by a tank that appeared while I was over its spawn point is the result of going for a bonus car. I think I might try ignoring the bonus cars instead of actually tying to kill them until I actually learn the game.

It totally doesn't belong here, but did anyone besides me get Snow Bros. Special? I credit-fed my way through it a few days ago. It's okay, I guess. Not my type of game, but it's passable, and probably at least a little more fun in mutiplayer. Not sure what to think of it yet, but I do know that I'm not going to put an insane amount of time into it like I will/am with Hishouzame, Same! Same! Same!, and Kyuukyoku Tiger.
User avatar
SPM
Posts: 452
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2020 7:04 pm

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by SPM »

Jeneki wrote:I think counting would become impossible at that red tower where you mash for points. So yeah, just the first car (or use the gadget).
That was my first thought as well, but the 10k bonus appears after 50 shots, so you could mash ~40 shots and then carefully deliver the rest. The extra tick points are worth nothing compared to the bonus cars anyway.

Also, the counter resets at the beginning of each stage, so we can "relax" on bosses :)
Steven wrote:I typically end up either wasting bombs or getting killed from hitting 16 shots and not shooting every time I try to get those bonus cars. That video I posted a while ago where I got a game over due to being insta-sniped by a tank that appeared while I was over its spawn point is the result of going for a bonus car. I think I might try ignoring the bonus cars instead of actually tying to kill them until I actually learn the game.
For sure! I don't intend to get them all or anything, but I think it could be a fun extra thing to do to boost replayability without looping endlessly.
"There are three possible endings: the good one, the bad one and death" - Locomalito, Super Hydorah
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

SPM wrote:For sure! I don't intend to get them all or anything, but I think it could be a fun extra thing to do to boost replayability without looping endlessly.
Yeah, I am probably going to try ignoring them. Hopefully that gets me some better results, although it's also just because I'm bad.

Totally not related, but it seems that someone has counterstopped PS4 Hishouzame. ZPS, you going to try for it? That would be pretty awesome... and likely take a while. I don't think I could sit there for however many hours that takes without going insane or something. I do want to at least try for the Slap Fight counterstop eventually, though.
User avatar
Rastan78
Posts: 1964
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 2:08 am

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Rastan78 »

Rastan78 wrote:Apparently that safe spot can be abused by using the yellow shot type to infinitely milk the boss.
BIL wrote:Yellow is vindicated at last. :cool: :lol:
Ben shinobi posted a video that shows that infinite yellow shot final boss milk I was talking about a while ago.

https://youtu.be/3xls_lIyBqo
User avatar
BIL
Posts: 18989
Joined: Thu May 10, 2007 12:39 pm
Location: COLONY

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by BIL »

Nice find! Can always count on Monsieur Shinobi. :cool:
XtraSmiley
Posts: 622
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2018 9:22 am
Location: Washigton DC

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by XtraSmiley »

Any indication yet on what the next game will be? Is it unusual they are waiting this long? I feel like they released info on the next games faster before.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

A diagnosis of the sound issues from a certain dude who absolutely knows what he's doing: https://twitter.com/manabn/status/1529505482230345728
User avatar
Ms. Tea
Posts: 347
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:03 am

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Ms. Tea »

Anyone who bought both Switch collections have a spare Teki Paki code they'd be willing to part with?
User avatar
hamfighterx
Posts: 558
Joined: Mon Aug 23, 2010 5:45 pm
Location: Bonus Round

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by hamfighterx »

Ms. Tea wrote:Anyone who bought both Switch collections have a spare Teki Paki code they'd be willing to part with?
Yes, actually. Check your PMs :)


In other M2-related news that might be part of why we haven't yet seen an announcement for the next Toaplan Arcade Garage release... M2 just retweeted a Sega announcement of a June 3 live stream for a new project. Same lineup of presenters as the 2019 stream for the Genesis/MD Mini (for which M2 ported the games). Perhaps another M2/Sega project that's taking up some of their time? I'll try to stop my mind from fantasizing about a Saturn Mini, or a new series of Sega Ages games (maybe featuring Model 2/Model 3 games!) - will help to prevent the disappointment from more ports of 16-bit console games that we've seen time and time again. Or maybe it's nothing but M2 amplifying the message from their friends at Sega; M2 does often give shoutouts to other companies via Twitter or their streams... but this one with the same people connected to a previous M2/Sega project does feel a little different.
Source: Gematsu
User avatar
Ms. Tea
Posts: 347
Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 5:03 am

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Ms. Tea »

Interesting... really curious what that's going to mean. And also, yeah, it makes sense that M2's contract work is what pays the bills for this stuff but also what distracts them from it.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

I'm actually hoping for Shin Sakura Taisen 2 more than anything else, even though I already know that's not what it will be because Sega is Sega. Still not really sure how I feel about Shin Sakura Taisen as a whole, but there are 2 things that I know for certain:

1. It's way better than Sakura Taisen V, which was a game that felt like an extremely rough, somewhat bland and soulless, and thoroughly mediocre approximation of the Sakura Taisen 1-4 experience at best. Let's pretend V Episode 0 doesn't exist.

2. Shin Sakura Taisen could really benefit from a sequel, as I think this new Teikoku Kagekidan has some potential.

Anyway, on topic: https://m2stg.com/hisho-same3/news.php#news220527

^ patch notes for stuff. Yay, Switch audio skipping is fixed! Never encountered any of the other bugs that they said they fixed, so I can't say about those. They deleted the input delay reduction option on Switch for some reason... I wonder why. Anyone interested in doing some lag tests to see what the pre-/post-patch lag difference is? I'd do it myself, but I don't have any lag testing equipment.
User avatar
Rastan78
Posts: 1964
Joined: Wed Jan 26, 2005 2:08 am

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Rastan78 »

Steven wrote:I already know that's not what it will be because Sega is Sega.
It will be new ports of MD Altered Beast and MD Golden Axe lol

I seriously hope they're not doing another mini. I get the appeal of them, but for me they're dead in the water bc of the high input lag etc. Wouldn't mind seeing them picking up where they left off with the Sega Ages line. Make good use of that Technosoft license and give us Elemental Master and Hyper Duel while they're at it.

Re: the input lag reduction, anyone know what it actually does? Do they simply turn V sync off? I've heard Nintendo has a platform wide restriction on including that option bc they don't like screen tearing showing up in games.

Total speculation on my part, but it could be Nintendo asked them to patch out the option after it slipped by QA certification?

Great news about the buggy audio getting fixed ASAP.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

Rastan78 wrote:It will be new ports of MD Altered Beast and MD Golden Axe lol
lol that would absolutely not surprise me at all at this point. I have lost track of how many times those 2 ROMs have shown up in collections over the years.
Rastan78 wrote:I seriously hope they're not doing another mini. I get the appeal of them, but for me they're dead in the water bc of the high input lag etc. Wouldn't mind seeing them picking up where they left off with the Sega Ages line. Make good use of that Technosoft license and give us Elemental Master and Hyper Duel while they're at it.
I don't know if the MD Mini and Genesis Mini sold all that well compared to the Nintendo mini consoles, partially since I'm too lazy to go check financial reports for the 2 companies, but also because the Sega mini was in stock for quite some time and I think the Nintendo ones insta-sold out. Maybe Sega was just better about supplying the amount needed to meet demand and Nintendo didn't for whatever reason.

Still, I'd like to see more Tecno Soft games as well. They put out Thunder Force IV and AC and Herzog Zwei on Sega Ages and Thunder Force III on the MD/G Mini and AC on the Astro City Mini, so hopefully they'll get the rest out. What I want more than anything is a rerelease of the real Thunder Force II, the X68000 version, not Thunder Force II MD. It's never been rereleased and it's very disappointing that the Saturn got II MD instead of the actual II, as the Saturn could have handled it just fine.
Rastan78 wrote:Re: the input lag reduction, anyone know what it actually does? Do they simply turn V sync off? I've heard Nintendo has a platform wide restriction on including that option bc they don't like screen tearing showing up in games.

Total speculation on my part, but it could be Nintendo asked them to patch out the option after it slipped by QA certification?

Great news about the buggy audio getting fixed ASAP.
I was under the impression that the input lag reduction thing is sort of like a ROM hack-type thing where they recoded the games to have less lag or something like that, although I'm not sure where I got that idea, now that I think about it. I checked the Switch Kyuukyoku Tiger-Heli collection and the option is actually just not there at all on Switch. It's also not in the patch notes anywhere on the website, so I'm guessing that collection never had it to begin with on Switch. Not sure why it was in the Shark collection and they removed it now. Pretty sure the option's there for both PS4 collections.

Maybe they just forced it to always being active on Switch or something. I'm honestly not sure why you would ever want to disable it and intentionally make the games have more lag, though. It will mimic the PCBs more accurately with it disabled, but I'm pretty sure nobody's going to not want reduced lag.

One thing that I didn't see in the patch notes was audio fixes for Same! Same! Same!, and I was having those, as well. Maybe they forgot to write it in the patch notes... no way, right? I wonder if I'll find audio glitches in Same! Same! Same! again after the patch. I have not downloaded it yet, but I will now.

Edit: what the heck? The input lag reduction option is still there in Same! Same! Same!... although I suppose the patch notes do say that they only removed it for Hishouzame. I don't think there's a way to intentionally cause the audio skipping, so I guess I'll just torture myself with this ridiculously difficult game in handheld mode for a little while to see what happens.
User avatar
subcons
Posts: 627
Joined: Mon Feb 28, 2005 5:27 am
Location: Baltimore, MD

M2 Toaplan collection

Post by subcons »

The input lag reduction setting is in Tiger-Heli; first option on the System Settings screen. I don’t think it’s in the settings for K-Tiger though.
Steven
Posts: 2874
Joined: Tue May 11, 2021 5:24 am
Location: Tokyo

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by Steven »

Oops, yeah, I forgot to check Tiger-Heli. Sometimes I forget that that collection has more than just Kyuukyoku Tiger...

Same! 1P seems fine in handheld with gadgets and stuff, so success, I suppose. Hopefully they fixed it and just didn't put it in the patch notes for some reason.
User avatar
BIL
Posts: 18989
Joined: Thu May 10, 2007 12:39 pm
Location: COLONY

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by BIL »

I love that we have devs who actively hunt down and destroy input latency. I could imagine a pro player with 30-40 years' worth of muscle memory might want significant, PCB-accurate lag, where it exists. Generally speaking though? I'd solder the game to my brainstem if I could. Image BURN IT ALL Image

Image
User avatar
heli
Posts: 585
Joined: Fri Sep 13, 2019 3:58 pm

Re: M2 Toaplan collection

Post by heli »

Image
My favourite icon
Post Reply