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 Post subject: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade version
PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 12:56 pm 


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Joined: 26 Jan 2005
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Location: Singapore
Hey

I have too many arcade PCBs, and I also love the Saturn, which takes much less space to collect for, so when there's a very good port Saturn of an Arcade game, I try not to buy the original arcade version and focus on the Saturn version instead.

Which games do you think are so much better/different in their arcade versions, that it definitely warrants playing them over the Saturn ports ?
My question is mostly about shmups, but not restricted to (I'm not that interested in 1 on 1 fighting games though).

So far I would say :
  • Gekirindan
  • Gun Frontier
  • Dodonpachi (I fell in love with the danmaku sub-genre while playing the Saturn version in the late 90s though)
  • Donpachi (?)
  • Chase HQ (the Saturn port could have easily been perfect and much easier to play than the arcade version, sigh...)

Edward's blog has been a valuable resource so far to help stir my decisions.
http://1cclog.blogspot.com/
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 1:49 pm 



Joined: 12 Mar 2019
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Mmm, not sure if you mean your list responds to the topic's title or to your in-message question, which are just the opposite? All those are easily seen as inferior versions which don't really add anything worthy with their differentiations (unless you need a horizontal monitor for originally vertical-monitor games?)

Elevator Action Returns has a better soundtrack (I think?) while not losing anything from the PCB. Can't remember if Bubble Symphony and Metal Black improved the audio as well.

Sengoku Blade, for an extra character and illustration mode, and Sol Divide, for an extra mode I never played.

Most interesting ones, Hyper Duel and Radiant Silvergun, one has a remake, the other a nice intro and a home mode which again, I never played. Same with Game Tengoku and Sando R.

Twinkle Star Sprites is a very good package with extra character and stuff, but sounds worse than the original.

Princess Kurara Daisakusen has a FMV intro and stuff, but loses the original intro in real time.

Sonic Wings Special was also different to SW Limited? Others will have to confirm.

Magical Drop remade the visuals, for the worse I'd say but if you're a fan of CG...

Magical Drop 3 sounds better than the NG version, but loses many animation frames for the background characters and it was easier?

I don't think it's been set if Guardian Force has less input latency than the arcade version. It's a question you see come and go here but never really answered?


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:18 pm 


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Sorry if the topic’s title is not clear - English is not my mother tongue - but I meant to ask : which Saturn ports are definitely worse than the arcade original ?

Although the question : "which Saturn ports are superior to the arcade original” is well worth answering as well :)
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 2:50 pm 


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DonPachi has a few issues. The most immediate one is a poor reproduction of Bob's commentary. It's very scratchy. Another is some odd slowdown, IIRC while the stage transition red gems are on the screen. Possibly in other places too but I don't remember. The boss explosion SFX from stage 2 is completely missing, it just goes "poof" silently. I found the non-wobble yoko mode was tricky to use because you have to dial-in the proper screen size settings to minimize shimmer.

On the other hand, Saturn DP is better than AC in that the BGM is higher quality.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 7:40 pm 



Joined: 12 Mar 2019
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parodius wrote:
Sorry if the topic’s title is not clear - English is not my mother tongue - but I meant to ask : which Saturn ports are definitely worse than the arcade original ?


Huh, it's me the one being an idiot for not reading twice. I misunderstood, sorry. But the answer is easy: almost all ports with no extras are worse than the original for being well, ports, and for needing to fill a RAM with CD reads. Ports which do this very well and keep all the content from the arcade version exist though: S. Gurentai, for example. The Cottons, the Columns and the Sega Ages in general (skip Power Drift and G. Force, though) too, I think. And the aforementioned, mostly.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sat Jun 20, 2020 10:10 pm 


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Donpachi Saturn is worth it just for the redbook OST alone, seriously it sounds 3 times better than ear-rape inducing arcade PBC version.
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 2:32 am 


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I thought the sound of Donpachi (as heard on MAME) was brilliant, low-tech sound of music included, as if played by megaphone, giving it "full alert!" quality. Whoever handled porting it to consoles, clearly did not "get" that. And the less said of DoDonPachi music, the better.
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 2:56 am 


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Darius II is a mess on Saturn.
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:00 am 


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It isn’t a great arcade game by any means but the Saturn port doesn’t hold up.
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 8:01 am 


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Bassa-Bassa wrote:
Sengoku Blade, for an extra character and illustration mode

As a sengoku blade freak, i must give my two cents

the Saturn version has a very different colour palette that appears very blue tinted. Also the explosions are missing animation frames here & there. another thing is the music sounds completely different on the Saturn (it uses the SCSP to synthesize the music vs the OPL chip of the arcade PCB) and there may be some minor sound FX that are missing or different. and the voice samples are completely different between the two versions.

overall i prefer the arcade.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 12:04 pm 



Joined: 12 Mar 2019
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I knew that not all the animation frames were intact but didn't know about the different palettes, now I'm intrigued. Difficulty and speed are the same in both versions, right?


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 12:24 pm 


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Layer Section on Saturn seems to be a great job. I can only compare it with MAME though. The Saturn version's Soundtrack seems to have been remixed. Would have been nice to have the option of both.

I prefer it but that's probably because I heard it before the original.

The TATE mode is what makes it of course. Any vert shooter console port with no TATE option is going to struggle against the arcade original but I can't think of any on Saturn that fail to offer that.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:53 pm 


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davyK wrote:
Any vert shooter console port with no TATE option is going to struggle against the arcade original but I can't think of any on Saturn that fail to offer that.

I might remember incorrectly but I think the Twinbee Deluxe Pack lacks tate mode.
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 1:53 pm 



Joined: 14 Jun 2019
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Seen the recent YouTube review of dodonpachi comparing all ports,saturn came out worst!but to me the game is still awsome it’s the only version of dodonpachi ive ever played so I don’t know any different.in general saturn shmups are amazing and even more so considering the saturn is 26yrs old!!!


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:23 pm 


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Aye - the Saturn DDP port gets a lot of criticism but I still enjoy it. I came it as part of the deal with my JP Saturn anyhow. Wouldn't pay the price for what it goes for now though - a collector's thing now.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 8:01 pm 


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Bassa-Bassa wrote:
I knew that not all the animation frames were intact but didn't know about the different palettes, now I'm intrigued. Difficulty and speed are the same in both versions, right?


I think the difficulty and speed is the same, but i’d have to look more closely at that. I havent noticed any subtle differences yet.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 8:26 pm 


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Bassa-Bassa wrote:
Princess Kurara Daisakusen has a FMV intro and stuff, but loses the original intro in real time.


Saturn Gunbird is similar in this regard. When running the game in tate, if DEMO is selected, the game will run through the arcade attract mode, but the animated portion of the intro sequence with the full screen character sprites flying around in front of a cloud bank is clearly encoded video whereas this sequence is real-time sprite data on the PCB. The rest of the game, outside of mid-level loading right before the final boss on stage 7, seems to be pretty accurate though.
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 9:29 pm 



Joined: 12 Mar 2019
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But Princess Kurara has two intros actually, one with the recorded arcade intro and another brand new for this version. Still, I wouldn't prefer it over the ROM-based arcade version. The videos' quality is awful and the CD reads, noticeable. Should have left it out of the list.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:45 pm 



Joined: 23 Mar 2011
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I prefer to play Cotton 2 on STV just so I don't have to mess with the Saturn RAM cart.


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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Tue Jun 23, 2020 2:54 pm 


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davyK wrote:
Layer Section on Saturn seems to be a great job. I can only compare it with MAME though. The Saturn version's Soundtrack seems to have been remixed. Would have been nice to have the option of both.

I prefer it but that's probably because I heard it before the original.

The TATE mode is what makes it of course. Any vert shooter console port with no TATE option is going to struggle against the arcade original but I can't think of any on Saturn that fail to offer that.


You beat me to it - I was going to mention the improved soundtrack here :D

Same for Darius Gaiden - worth owning a copy on Saturn for the Redbook audio soundtrack alone, but the game is outstanding, and it's a pretty good conversion. Not sure it's "arcade perfect" but it certainly plays very well. And if you have the Action Replay cartridge, there are some fun cheats you can use with the game to play it completely overpowered, which is fun just because.
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 Post subject: Re: Saturn ports that don't hold a candle to the arcade vers
PostPosted: Wed Jun 24, 2020 5:05 am 


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FRO wrote:
Same for Darius Gaiden - worth owning a copy on Saturn for the Redbook audio soundtrack alone, but the game is outstanding, and it's a pretty good conversion. Not sure it's "arcade perfect" but it certainly plays very well. And if you have the Action Replay cartridge, there are some fun cheats you can use with the game to play it completely overpowered, which is fun just because.


You don't even need an Action Replay. Just input the Full Auto code at the title screen and laugh your way to a 1CC.

davyK wrote:
Layer Section on Saturn seems to be a great job. I can only compare it with MAME though. The Saturn version's Soundtrack seems to have been remixed. Would have been nice to have the option of both.


I think the only notable difference (when playing in Tate) is that the extend values are set at different score thresholds than the F3 PCB.
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