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 Post subject: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 4:10 pm 


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It just occours to me. The standard Arcade Control Setup put the joystick on the left side and buttons on the right side. But most people are right handed. By puting the joystick on the left hand side, the setup are forcing players to use their left hand to do the job which requires more delicated contol when compare to the buttons. :?
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 4:25 pm 



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You could always try crosshanded if the joysticks and buttons are close enough together. Though I've found that makes it harder.

Kinda like a guitar, I guess. They are designed for right handed people (unless you get a lefty model), but the left hand does the more complicated stuff on the fret board as opposed to strumming with the right hand.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 5:08 pm 


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When did the conspiracy start? Seems like some 80s shmups allowed for either option, like Xevious with its duplicate buttons on either side of the joystick

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And the gravis gamepad and atari lynx each allowed for a switch to be flipped to allow for the dpad (and screen on the lynx) to be inverted and the device to be used upside down with the dpad on the right... though I have never heard of anyone in the history of the world preferring to play that way.


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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 5:29 pm 


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Inputs that need to be mashed are best suited to the stronger dominant hand. Directional inputs, which are merely held down for comparatively longer periods of time, are fine handled by the weaker hand. I can't imagine trying to play a fighting game with complicated inputs like Guilty Gear XX with my hands reversed at any level of competency. I've always wondered if lefties are underrepresented in video games played at a high performance level.

What we should really address in this thread is the complete ineptitude among Japanese doujin PC game developers in mapping the default inputs to garbage like ZXCV and arrow keys so you have to control your hands in the reverse manner of every other standard input method. The worst part being when they provide no option whatsoever for remapping the inputs how the player wants (a basic standard in most PC games for a couple decades now). As I understand it, this situation arises because nearly everyone in Japan who actually plays games on a PC has a controller on hand to plug in, so the reason keyboard control is such an afterthought is because few ever actually have to deal with it. The Western PC game world moved on to WASD for movement in the '90s for a good reason.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 5:53 pm 


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Came here to post basically what MathU said. Stick on left hand is infinitely more comfortable than the other way around.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 5:53 pm 


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MathU wrote:
As I understand it, this situation arises because nearly everyone in Japan who actually plays games on a PC has a controller on hand to plug in, so the reason keyboard control is such an afterthought is because few ever actually have to deal with it. The Western PC game world moved on to WASD for movement in the '90s for a good reason.


What's weirder to me is how many of them have continued to not implement newer standards for gamepads, most notably XInput, which most PC gamepads made within the past decade now support, they still only support barebones DInput with the D-Pad tied to an axis which makes using D-Pads on XInput based controllers difficult

Personally, when using keyboard, arrow key controls don't bother me for 2D games, but I've put a lot of time into old PC games from the pre-WASD era as well, so its strangely natural to me despite using the opposite hands for control


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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 7:32 pm 



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When button mashing is not involved and it's about precision and not stamina, I vastly prefer the stick/arrow keys on my right, and perform noticeably better too. I only noticed this very recently after playing Monolith and pondering why I suck that much. So yes, this is yet another justification for me to bring my modded keyboard to Guilty Gear tournaments.

To Far Away Times wrote:
You could always try crosshanded if the joysticks and buttons are close enough together. Though I've found that makes it harder.

Kinda like a guitar, I guess. They are designed for right handed people (unless you get a lefty model), but the left hand does the more complicated stuff on the fret board as opposed to strumming with the right hand.


I strongly disagree. Fretting hand is a robot; you teach it what to do and you're done, very mechanical, very straightforward. Right hand dictates sound, speed, and precision; it's often the bottleneck for all of these things and taking it out of the equation makes everything a breeze, e.g., tapping acrobatics at insane speeds are far easier than they look. The physiological and psychological complexity of right hand proficiency becomes more obvious with more technical styles, maybe not typical pop/rock strumming. (I'm a classically educated [oh the horrors of music school], technical metal playing deviant)
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 8:10 pm 



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Does anyone else use stick with left (any genre), keyboard directions with left hand fingers (shmups) and right hand directional keys for fighting/platformers?

Can't do it comfortably any other way.


Last edited by el_rika on Thu May 07, 2020 7:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 8:31 pm 


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Atari 2600 joystick was made to use your right hand on the stick, left thumb on the button. Could always wire one of those to your cab and try it out. :P
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2020 9:17 pm 



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kane wrote:

To Far Away Times wrote:
You could always try crosshanded if the joysticks and buttons are close enough together. Though I've found that makes it harder.

Kinda like a guitar, I guess. They are designed for right handed people (unless you get a lefty model), but the left hand does the more complicated stuff on the fret board as opposed to strumming with the right hand.


I strongly disagree. Fretting hand is a robot; you teach it what to do and you're done, very mechanical, very straightforward. Right hand dictates sound, speed, and precision; it's often the bottleneck for all of these things and taking it out of the equation makes everything a breeze, e.g., tapping acrobatics at insane speeds are far easier than they look. The physiological and psychological complexity of right hand proficiency becomes more obvious with more technical styles, maybe not typical pop/rock strumming. (I'm a classically educated [oh the horrors of music school], technical metal playing deviant)


Interesting... I am not classically trained per say, but I feel like I put almost all my thought into my left hand, the right hand just matches up with the left automatically, more or less. Finger style does necessitate some thought on the right hand but I still feel like most of that is automatic (especially if the piece allows you to dedicate your thumb for the bottom three strings). I am mostly focused on pop and rock though (with some classical) so I don't have the widest range. I do wonder if the left hand is robotic because there is so much muscle memory already there.

I know some lefties end up playing right handed instruments. My brother learned bass that way and was taught by a teacher who did the same. Might be out of necessity though, finding a left handed bass in a music shop pre-online shopping would be rarer than finding a needle in a haystack.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 3:53 am 



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On keyboard I usually end up playing 2D games with movement on the right and 3D games with it on the left. Don't know why, and I'm a lefty (but compromised, like most lefties). The factor of which way round you learn it is probably a lot more significant than any rationalizing of it. Plus in my experience it's totally possible to have both ways as long as the input method is different enough, e.g stick versus keyboard, because you'll need to reacquire the muscle memory when learning anyway. If standard sticks were the other way around I doubt it'd make much difference, your body's going to adapt to it anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Thu May 07, 2020 4:22 pm 


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I vaguely remember a Guru Larry video suggesting that having joysticks on the left side was part of a scheme to get more quarters pumping by making it harder for people to play effectively being right handed.

Can't say how accurate that is.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2020 2:59 pm 


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Apparently in Greece during the 80s and 90s the stick was on the right and buttons were on the left where the dominant hand was was used to input direction.


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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Tue May 12, 2020 9:44 pm 


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It's a logical jump to conclude that "right-handed == joystick should be in the right hand".

I would also take any console and PC-game focused "personality" with a lump of salt. Youtube personalities and general "game fans" have historically had really jank takes on the intents of the arcade industry's design choices.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2020 1:23 pm 


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drunkninja24 wrote:
MathU wrote:
Personally, when using keyboard, arrow key controls don't bother me for 2D games, but I've put a lot of time into old PC games from the pre-WASD era as well, so its strangely natural to me despite using the opposite hands for control


Same. I grew up playing shareware games, and computer games in general, using the arrow keys with my right hand, and action keys with my left. It never struck me as counter-intuitive as a kid, because there wasn't any choice in the matter. Similarly, the joysticks on my IBM PCjr were right hand, with the buttons on the left side of it. Same with my next door neighbor's Atari 2600 joysticks. Oddly enough, it didn't feel weird to me to switch to controlling something via my left had when playing on NES, or in the arcade. We just adapted to those changes, and rolled with it. As an adult, I'm more prone to trying to standardize on left-hand-control, right-hand-buttons, however. And more often, I'm trying to use an arcade stick on as much as I can.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2020 1:19 am 


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Other then the game contorl settings, nearly all early Arcade games have the screen placed in Tate position. But for human vision, it is more easy follow actions on a wide screen then a tall screen.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2020 7:57 am 


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I don't think that's necessarily true. At least personally, I track vertical actions better than horizontal ones. Vision is larger horizontally but that doesn't necessarily translate to easier tracking.

Is this the shmupsforum pseudoscience thread now?
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2020 8:06 am 


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More like CUMSPIRACY, how are you supposed to jack it to *~KAWAII ANIME GIRLZ~* ω´ with both hands on the controller? They obviously want you backed up to your eyeballs so you'll fork out them dakimakura bux :evil:

:shock: :idea:

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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2020 8:06 pm 


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lazenby wrote:
Apparently in Greece during the 80s and 90s the stick was on the right and buttons were on the left where the dominant hand was was used to input direction.


This is true, I went to a couple of arcades in Crete late 90,s and all the cabs controls were reversed... lots of NEO GEO games and I found it impossible to play any.

Sticks on right, buttons on left.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2020 4:18 am 


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Joystick with the left hand, HAH.

Joystick with the right hand, HAH.

Joystick with the middle hand, OMG YES!

Spoiler: show
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2020 6:06 am 


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Do you operate that with your mouth, or...
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2020 11:33 am 


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MathU wrote:
Do you operate that with your mouth, or...


GaijinPunch wrote:
Someone PM me when we have to play w/ the stick up our asses.
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 Post subject: Re: Conspiracy in the Standard Arcade Control Setup
PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2020 12:04 pm 


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Jeneki wrote:
Joystick with the middle hand, OMG YES!

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