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 Post subject: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 5:35 pm 



Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Posts: 91
I've tried like 10x times to sit down and play this game but it never really gets me in any sort of groove. I really think it's the time mechanic that irritates me.

I have yet to try EX though but I am pretty sure that keeps the time mechanic? I really wish there was an option to eliminate time and just go "one hit equals death" like pretty much 90% of all shmups (unless I am missing an option somewhere? lol)

Anyone else into the game?


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 5:50 pm 


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Yeah that one doesn't get much love around here. Great aesthetics, meh mechanics.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 6:50 pm 


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Because it's a bad game.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 8:31 pm 


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awbacon wrote:
Anyone else into the game?


Not for me.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Fri Sep 20, 2019 9:07 pm 


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yeah, I used to give it a replay every once in a while to see if "maybe I'll actually like it this time", but never really happened
From my now-hazy memory there are some good spots of level design in the game and cool setpieces, but most of that is towards the latter half of the game, while the front half is a lot of "enemies flying in straight lines like 1945.gm6" or "slowly go through tunnel shooting like 5 enemies per minute". A lot of boss design seemed kinda eh, too, like they had a bunch of turrets shooting different patterns but the patterns felt like they weren't complimenting each other.
there's a lot of little things like that

there's no option for a One Hit Death mode, but on Maniac and honestly even at times on Hard Mode (these two are only available in Arcade mode for some silly reason) the Timer is strict enough that taking one or two hits will probably kill you, or at least drop your Timer enough that you're basically in a dead game now :V
hell, on Maniac just letting a few enemies fly by you is enough to run out of Time at spots

I'm vaguely curious as to what all EX version might have changed... just not curious enough to buy it :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:25 am 


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To be honest, I used to enjoy this game quite a lot back then, especially the Arcade mode on Hard. Not so much nowadays when I started to play "better" shmups and realizing that playing for score in this game is dumb. I actually was afraid to say this

mamboFoxtrot wrote:
I'm vaguely curious as to what all EX version might have changed... just not curious enough to buy it :lol:


IIRC, the EX version is pretty much the same as the original, except:
- Arcade mode only lets you play in Challenging and Hard (you can only play Insane in Score Attack, which is an individual stage mode) instead of Hard and Insane like the original, making Arcade mode more beginner-friendly.
- There's an actual focus button that makes you slower, which in the original version didn't have.
- You can change the aspect ratio from 16:10 to 16:9.
- English dialog, original version only had Hungary dialog.
- There's a Co-op mode where the 1P plays the ship while 2P plays a small pea shooter "drone".
- VS mode of three minigames (Local multiplayer only).
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:35 am 



Joined: 22 Sep 2009
Posts: 91
mamboFoxtrot wrote:
yeah, I used to give it a replay every once in a while to see if "maybe I'll actually like it this time", but never really happened
From my now-hazy memory there are some good spots of level design in the game and cool setpieces, but most of that is towards the latter half of the game, while the front half is a lot of "enemies flying in straight lines like 1945.gm6" or "slowly go through tunnel shooting like 5 enemies per minute". A lot of boss design seemed kinda eh, too, like they had a bunch of turrets shooting different patterns but the patterns felt like they weren't complimenting each other.
there's a lot of little things like that

there's no option for a One Hit Death mode, but on Maniac and honestly even at times on Hard Mode (these two are only available in Arcade mode for some silly reason) the Timer is strict enough that taking one or two hits will probably kill you, or at least drop your Timer enough that you're basically in a dead game now :V
hell, on Maniac just letting a few enemies fly by you is enough to run out of Time at spots

I'm vaguely curious as to what all EX version might have changed... just not curious enough to buy it :lol:



You just nailed it. The “dead game” feeling. Playing knowing you don’t have enough time to keep going but you still have some time before you die. Like playing any checkpoint driving game...you know you are screwed with thirty seconds left to suffer


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:39 am 


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Yeah unfortunately the game doesn't hold up to repeated play. Blast through a few times to enjoy the story, graphics and different ships and move on to something more polished imo.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 12:56 pm 


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Everything in the game just feels terrible. And unlike some other people, I don't even like the aesthetic. In fact, I hate it.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 1:01 pm 



Joined: 13 Sep 2019
Posts: 64
You should look to youtube first before buying.
The first thing i notice it has camshake on every enemy.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 2:37 pm 


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It's garbage.

The power-ups fly off the screen as soon as you get hit. I don't mean in a classic late 80's early 90's shmup way, but in that they fly off through impassable terrain or right off the screen never to return.

Also the final boss has a safe spot that even a complete clown like me was able to find on my first time through.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2019 7:48 pm 


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heli wrote:
The first thing i notice it has camshake on every enemy.

you should be able to turn the shake off
pretty sure that was one of the few suggestions from the old thread here that they actually implemented :lol:


MauCast wrote:
- Arcade mode only lets you play in Challenging and Hard (you can only play Insane in Score Attack, which is an individual stage mode) instead of Hard and Insane like the original, making Arcade mode more beginner-friendly.
- There's an actual focus button that makes you slower, which in the original version didn't have.

oh, a focus button is nice. I didn't have an issue with it, but a lot of people didn't like being forced into using the analog stick to keep control of their craft.
Adding another difficulty mode to Arcade is good, but removing the other is kinda :? I'm kinda scared as to what their programming is for Difficulty Modes must be if they have it all split up between modes like this... I know there's some differences in level design and mechanics between Story and Arcade mode but it seems hard to believe that its so different that they would be unable to fully implement the difficulty selections.
MauCast wrote:
Not so much nowadays when I started to play "better" shmups and realizing that playing for score in this game is dumb.

Yeah, that's kinda the big thing with this game and its initial positive reception in the magazines and such. Its a functional game and looks nice, its not FLAGRANTLY bad, its just if you get used to the standards of other shmups, then this game starts to look silly in a lot of areas by comparison.
The scoring system definitely highlights one of the weaknesses: Every 5th enemy or so yields a Medal, but I don't recall being at risk of losing that Medal that often, in part due to the low enemy counts.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 12:45 am 


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Elaphe wrote:
Because it's a bad game.

:idea:
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 1:52 am 


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mamboFoxtrot wrote:
yeah, I used to give it a replay every once in a while to see if "maybe I'll actually like it this time", but never really happened


This is pretty much me right here, although every time I try I can't ever seem to bear making it more than a stage or two into the game.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 2:59 pm 


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Austin wrote:
mamboFoxtrot wrote:
yeah, I used to give it a replay every once in a while to see if "maybe I'll actually like it this time", but never really happened


This is pretty much me right here, although every time I try I can't ever seem to bear making it more than a stage or two into the game.


Do not even bother, the stage 3 part in the debris tube is nearly impossible ; unless it was patched somehow in newer versions ?
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:19 pm 


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MauCast wrote:
- There's an actual focus button that makes you slower, which in the original version didn't have.

wow, that's a minor change that severely affects (in a good way) gameplay!

guigui wrote:
the stage 3 part in the debris tube is nearly impossible ; unless it was patched somehow in newer versions ?

it is possible
I would very much prefer if they had removed the bullshit piano thing
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 23, 2019 8:50 pm 



Joined: 26 Jan 2005
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The Nintendo Switch port of Sine Mora clocks in as a 999mb d/l at best. You can play it on the go or on a bigger HDTV setup if you so wish to do so. It runs at an arcade-spec 60 fps (frames per second) framerate indeed.

Yep, the dreaded piano falling on your fightercraft is apt to happen at times.

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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2019 4:21 am 


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your not alone.

I love how the game looks but I just can't seem to get into it either.
I find it very hard too because I'm terrible :oops:


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sun Sep 29, 2019 5:04 am 


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Yeah, I tried this game several times and uh....no.
God no. It feels like ass and has some of the worst pacing I've seen in a game like this. Awful balance too. So many nagging issues.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Mon Sep 30, 2019 9:32 pm 


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Elaphe wrote:
Because it's a bad game.


qft
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 01, 2019 3:24 pm 


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I used to follow everything Grasshopper did. At some point I woke up and realized they kinda just make bad games. I guess punk IS dead.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 7:25 am 


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'Cause it's not very good.

Weird choices in that game.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 05, 2019 6:24 pm 



Joined: 22 Apr 2019
Posts: 10
I played the game on the Switch ~2 years ago and enjoyed it. It has a few design problems, but I still think that it's better than Raiden V or 2/3's of the Psikyo switch ports. If you understand that it's more of a boss rush game with mostly easyish popcorn sections to break up the action, I think that you will enjoy it more.

Off the top of my head the problems are:
- The scoring system is really bland. You get all of these bombs and special powers, but you shouldn't use them.
- If you score too high, you can't post to the leaderboards. I saw several comments about that in the original thread. I managed to once for some reason, but I couldn't repeat it.
- There are too many long cutscenes.
- The power-up drops are way too random.
- The Palladion boss's first phase can bug out if you try to destroy every part of it (about 1/3rd of the time)
- The Libelle boss can be very hard or easy depending on its attack pattern order.
- On hard, the Domus boss can be impossible to get through without taking the shortcut (and resetting your score multiplier) if your firepower is too high and you don't have a time extend available.
- For the above, I think that only 2 of the characters' special attacks can activate the shortcut. IMO, that about invalidates all of the other characters.
- Can't play arcade on insane in EX.
- The EX version defaults to the new fullscreen (16:9), which makes the game much more difficult.
- Co-op is poorly implemented and only exists in story mode.
- The piano of sadism (WTF were the devs thinking? I was one of the few who liked the game enough to put 100+ hours into it and the piano made me quit.)

I got used to the analog controls, so I don't consider it a problem.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Tue Oct 08, 2019 1:55 am 



Joined: 11 Sep 2012
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Sina Mora comits so many Euro shmup sins... I think just about the only thing they left out was the inertia.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:36 pm 



Joined: 22 Sep 2009
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To Far Away Times wrote:
Sina Mora comits so many Euro shmup sins... I think just about the only thing they left out was the inertia.


Lol at least that. I guess I am def not alone in not being able to enjoy this game


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2019 2:49 pm 



Joined: 13 Sep 2019
Posts: 64
mamboFoxtrot wrote:
heli wrote:
The first thing i notice it has camshake on every enemy.

you should be able to turn the shake off
pretty sure that was one of the few suggestions from the old thread here that they actually implemented :lol:


Oh that is good.
Only after online update ofcourse.
Why these devs dont understand themselfs ?
Then there is also this game : Matterfall, total non understanding devs and testers, same counts for the new contra.

If you can make games so stupid, i will be rich when i realease a game,
or maybe they make it stpuid so the main stream can play ?
Really SHMUPS arent for RPG players.

It is impossible that whole teams are stupid,
look how long that lists are at credits,
why no one told about it sucks ?


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2019 10:28 am 


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I guess I'm in the minority group, because I really got into this game and loved it. I find it to be a breath of fresh air and appreciate so much that it's trying new things to expand the genre. It's much more than some Cave clone.
Sure, it's got some design issues and the usual Euro problem of not enough popcorn enemies, but the graphics are wonderful, the game play eventually sucked me in, and the scoring and life systems are unique and interesting.
The only thing I can really fault the game for is the storyline which is too ambitious for its own good. But I think there's a mode in EX where you can play without it.
8/10
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sat Oct 12, 2019 2:06 pm 


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The short answer:

Elaphe wrote:
Because it's a bad game.


The long answer:

The dev once came to the forum and asked for people's impressions then completely ignored all player feedback. Essentially, it's a shmup made by a group that doesn't really play shmups, hence why you have bad controls that can't be remapped, an autofire that is too slow to feel fun AND can be broken with an autofire controller to the point of stupidity, mechanics ripped from Giga Wing and Espgaluda that are stripped of their scoring meaningfulness, forced reliance on analog controls due to lack of a slowdown button for people playing d-pad or stick, the stupid piano, the stupid powerups immediately running offscreen, the stupid running out of time during a fight immediately gameovering you instead of putting you 1 hit away from death for like a 10-20 second period leading to silly deaths if you aren't speedkilling stuff, etc. The music also

It's a game without any real understanding of shmups whose core mechanic isn't super compelling (nor was it in the bizarre kusoge doujin Wisplisp Array of List which came out before Sine Mora).

The music also sucks in my opinion, though not because of a lack of technical proficiency (it's composed by Akira Yamaoka of Silent Hill fame) but because it's just unfitting for the game and generally feels out of place in a shmup. The composer has some decent "action games" under his belt as far as music goes, but his specialty is more subtle atmospheric stuff.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 1:20 am 


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Isn't this that weird M-rated furry warfare shmup? I think I watched part of a playthrough and wasn't very impressed.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora...why can't I enjoy it?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2019 7:30 am 


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BareKnuckleRoo wrote:

The long answer:

The dev once came to the forum and asked for people's impressions then completely ignored all player feedback.


They seriously ignored all feedback? Wow


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