Predict what shmupsfans say about Gigawing Generations

[Neon]

Some will enjoy it because it's on the ps2. Others will be hurt that it was not ported to the gamecube or dreamcast, and perhaps start a useless petition.

Some will complain that they didn't include previous games in the series as well.

One or two guys will hate it for baseless reasons.

[Super Laydock]

Well, they'll hopefully just say it's better than Giga Wing 2!

I'd love to have this game on dreamcast, but thinking realistically I know that won't happen ever. Let's just hope the game is ported well, and stop bitching about ports to other platforms. We are lucky to see any port at all I think.

[Guest]

GWG is a sweet game. Very accessible and score-based. I enjoyed it until the Taito Type X PC hardware crashed for good before Christmas .

The graphics were crusty but I didn't care.

[jp]

I heard it was the worst of the series... but I've never played it myself so *shrugs*

[Zhon]

Right before release, everyone will be like OMG GET THIS! WOW WE'RE GETTING A NEW SHMUP!!!!111thousandhundredandeleven

And right after release - like 3 people will actually buy it.

[Rob]

Well, they'll hopefully just say it's better than Giga Wing 2!

That would be nice, wouldn't it? Highly doubt it, but I expect to enjoy it more than the first, since it seems to take the original play dynamics and probably smooths them out.

I need to get my GW2 ST back up, but the formatting... grr.

A lot of people seem to be fairly indifferent to the series. I don't think there will be much talk of it at all, negative or positive.

[TVG]

i clicked on this topic in hopes to read some stuff about how GWG is, so i can either be happy or not care (it isnt very good from what ive read so far) but instead i got this...oh god.

is the majority of the forum like that? i dont think so.

its one thing buying and not playing XII stalag, but when a good game comes, i mean, you play it :s

edit: i like GW1 a lot, even if i prefer mars matrix.
can you people post a honest view of why it should be ported to DC instead of PS2 plz?

[Darkcomet72]

can you people post a honest view of why it should be ported to DC instead of PS2 plz?

It's alot easier to play imported games on a DC than on PS2. All you need is one of those import disks.

For the PS2, the only proper method is to have someone install a modchip, or use other methods, which might not even work with some games.

Anyway, it would be a lot easier if the console market was a Monopoly.

[TVG]

about the monopoly thing, i meant to say ps2/Xbox/GC

but still, there's the 30$ thing to play imported games on the ps2, the freeloader for GC and xbox...i dunno.

i dont think that its that much easier, mainly because DC imports tend to be ridiculously overpriced.

i cry for when the day comes that my DC breaks, and when ill need to spend a shitload of money to play my DC games if the DC becomes "rare" (read: overhyped by malicious sellers)

i cant see any practical reason as to why id prefer a game on a DC rather than on a next gen console (and yes, i got all 4 consoles now)

[BrianC]

I would like this game to be released in the US, but many shooters don't make it here. Sony's lack of love towards 2D games, the lack of love by many publishers of shmups, and Sony's heavy use of region protection is not a good combination. I wouldn't mind a DC release either considering that my DC-X needs more lovin'.

[TVG]

well, you americans are unlucky, in europe, we tend to get PAL ports at ridiculous prices ^^

altough it sucks when they dont include 60HZ, might as well not buy anything.

[dave4shmups]

I'm sure I'll love this game, as I love the first two. Also, my fav. bullet-hell shmups are ones where you can actually use the enemy's bullets against them in some way.

[BulletMagnet]

I'll fall into the category of "Wait and see what opinions rise when the thing is released and more people have had the chance to play it, before buying or not buying it yourself." The first 2 GW games, as far as I'm concerned, were, as the robotic voice therein says, "O-K", but I wouldn't classify the new one as a "must buy" for me.

[whoisKeel]

Don't we have a pretty good chance that this will make it to the US? I mean, Giga Wing, Giga Wing 2, and Mars Matrix all made it here...what Takumi shmups haven't made it here? I'm just being optimistic I guess.

[Ghegs]

Don't we have a pretty good chance that this will make it to the US? I mean, Giga Wing, Giga Wing 2, and Mars Matrix all made it here...what Takumi shmups haven't made it here? I'm just being optimistic I guess.

At least Night Raid, but you're really not missing out on anything there.

[Cthulhu]

I've played an beaten the game in the arcades here. I was really underwhelmed with it, for the most part. Yes, it's more GW, and that is a good thing. The framerate has severe problems though, and it actually gets in the way of the game itself -- with how many bullets are flying about onscreen, you need to be able to weave through hundreds (thousands at times?) of bullets PERFECTLY. Good luck doing that when the hardware is hiccuping. The level designs are okay, as are most of the bosses -- but some of the bosses just feel really uninspired.

Unless the PS2 version of the game is cleaned up or has some noteworthy new features... I'm probably not going to bother with it.

[DantesInferno]

I got a feeling it's going to be somewhat lukewarm as a game. I have heard issues with framerate..and I think the full vert may take a bit to get used to with the other GW games being full screen. I think what I am most disapointed with is the lack of pilots and more ships. Hopefully it gets a bit of a clean-up like others mentioned.

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

can you people post a honest view of why it should be ported to DC instead of PS2 plz?

It's alot easier to play imported games on a DC than on PS2. All you need is one of those import disks.

For the PS2, the only proper method is to have someone install a modchip, or use other methods, which might not even work with some games.

Anyway, it would be a lot easier if the console market was a Monopoly.

Actually, it would be a lot "easier" if they simply ported it out to the USA!
I know nothing of GWG, but I love the first two!

As much as I like the Dreamcast, its pretty much a dead console...at least sales wise and consumer wise. Thats one good reason you may not see a port of GWG on it.

[chtimi-CLA]

to those who have played it, how is the music? anything like gw2?

[Ghegs]

Luckily (?) I haven't played the earlier GW games so I won't be projecting any expectations into Generations. In fact, I have no expectations at all about the game, which might be a good thing. If it sucks, I won't be disappointed. If it's good, I'll be pleasantly surprised. It's a win-win situation.

I do hope they fix that framerate up a bit, though, if it's indeed as bad as Cthulhu makes it to be.

[raiden]

The framerate has severe problems though, and it actually gets in the way of the game itself -- with how many bullets are flying about onscreen, you need to be able to weave through hundreds (thousands at times?) of bullets PERFECTLY. Good luck doing that when the hardware is hiccuping.

did you play the original Giga Wing in its CPS2 version? I just ask because it also has severe slowdowns, but remains completely playable, because bullet slowdown doesn´t affect maneuverability. Concerning Type X, however, I´ve read several negative comments, also regarding Raiden III, not only about slowdowns, but laggy input and crashing software as well. Just like we´re used to on the PC. Since then, I´ve also stopped all thoughts on ever buying a Type X system.

[TWITCHDOCTOR]

Luckily (?) I haven't played the earlier GW games so I won't be projecting any expectations into Generations. In fact, I have no expectations at all about the game, which might be a good thing. If it sucks, I won't be disappointed. If it's good, I'll be pleasantly surprised. It's a win-win situation.

I do hope they fix that framerate up a bit, though, if it's indeed as bad as Cthulhu makes it to be.

I don't know why you're holding out. GigaWing 1&2 are great shooties! PLus, you can get em cheap on Ebay.

[Ghegs]

Luckily (?) I haven't played the earlier GW games so I won't be projecting any expectations into Generations. In fact, I have no expectations at all about the game, which might be a good thing. If it sucks, I won't be disappointed. If it's good, I'll be pleasantly surprised. It's a win-win situation.

I do hope they fix that framerate up a bit, though, if it's indeed as bad as Cthulhu makes it to be.

I don't know why you're holding out. GigaWing 1&2 are great shooties! PLus, you can get em cheap on Ebay.

'Coz I don't have a DC.

[Cthulhu]

I do hope they fix that framerate up a bit, though, if it's indeed as bad as Cthulhu makes it to be.

Well, while the framerate doesn't -look- all that bad, it really hurts the game due to how precise you need to be. Perhaps "framerate" is the wrong word... the game doesn't get slowdown like most other shmups do when the screen gets flooded with bullets - it starts dropping a couple of frames to keep things smoother. And in a shmup, one or two missing frames = death. Painful death. Painful 100 yen coin consuming death.

I could be wrong about the frame-dropping technicalities, but the game gets choppy at any rate, no two ways about that.

[Darkcomet72]

Luckily (?) I haven't played the earlier GW games so I won't be projecting any expectations into Generations. In fact, I have no expectations at all about the game, which might be a good thing. If it sucks, I won't be disappointed. If it's good, I'll be pleasantly surprised. It's a win-win situation.

I try to have no expectations for any game. It really is the best strategy when it comes to buying any game.

[Ghegs]

the game doesn't get slowdown like most other shmups do when the screen gets flooded with bullets - it starts dropping a couple of frames to keep things smoother.

That's weird, since it's totally a programming choice to make whether the game slows down or starts dropping frames when the hardware can't keep up. V-sync or v-timer, something to do with those terms...somebody who actually knows this stuff can elaborate better.

[raiden]

V-sync or v-timer, something to do with those terms

you were probably referring to framesync vs. timesync. While videogames and especially arcade games have traditionally always been frame-synchronized, timesync is the common method of choice on the PC platform.

Framesync means each time a new picture is drawn (usually each 1/60th of a second), all gameplay elements get calculated. The good part of this method is a very smooth picture, the bad part is that slowdowns can occur if the hardware isn´t capable to render all game logic with time.

Timesync means the gameplay-calculating loop becomes dominant over picture rendering. It works like this: each time the loop is done, it keeps track of the time it took to run through once. This time can vary due to different factors, for example calculating a lot of bullet paths can take longer than calculating just a few, or the hardware the program is running on (that´s why this method is popular on PC). This time unit is then used in the next loop as a multiplier for all movement elements. While a framesynced game might let the spaceship move 3 pixels each frame, the timesynced one will vary that value depending on how long the last loop took.

So, after calculating this time, picture rendering starts immediately, no matter where the cathode ray is at that moment. This can imply the picture "tearing up" because it changes in the middle of the screen from the old to the new frame. Another problem is that the time-calculation is always one step behind. If one loop took 3/20th of a second to calculate, but the next one only takes 1/100th, the movement will get unstable. In other games, this may just bug you a little, but when playing a shmup, where you try to analyze bullet patterns of varying speed in realtime, an unstable movement throws your whole basis for calculation of, making the game almost unplayable. Slowdown, the drawback of framesync, on the other hand, is much more manageable, because while it creates a kind of unstable movement as well, it also gives you more time to analyze the pattern each time it gets unstable.

The problem is just that basically every PC programming tutorial teaches people to use timesync. Timesync is also the harder algorithm to implement in comparison with framesync, and many professional programmers tend to disregard framesync as a "child´s way of programming". While most jp. amateur shmups offer the player a choice between both methods, aware of the problems described above, the GWG development team obviously wasn´t so smart. Type X is not a PC, it´s a defined piece of hardware with no need to make programs scalable, yet they used what they had learned without caring for the implications. I´m pretty disappointed.

[Ghegs]

V-sync or v-timer, something to do with those terms

you were probably referring to framesync vs. timesync.

Yes, exactly that. Thank you for the explanation.

Sounds extremely odd that the GWG team didn't realise this, hasn't even one of them ever worked on a shmup before? Or played one, for that matter. It's so obvious even non-programmers like me can instantly see the advantage of framesync.