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 Post subject: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:46 am 


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Joined: 04 Feb 2005
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Location: Northern California
It's a habit I've had for the longest time.

Fellow shmuppers keep trying to drill it into me that I should go for a 1CC first; until then, score is a goddamned meaningless number. Yet I'm so impatient that I try to learn the scoring system, chaining if any, etc. before worrying about my safety.

I'm starting to think I am playing shmups the wrong way. Plus most people don't even find playing for score fun anyway.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:58 am 


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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:26 am 


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Playing for score can be helpful for a 1cc, if the game in question gives score-based extends you wouldn't otherwise receive. As an extreme example, I dare you to play Battle Garegga for 1cc before playing for score. :twisted:
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:29 am 


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I don't think playing for score first is that bad, After all, You'll end learning some safe routes sooner or later, Also, You can always get extends and stuff, But as mentioned above in some games scoring and survival are bound together.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 5:34 am 


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Also you can try some games where playing for survival ends up giving you more points in the process.

For example, Raiden III and IV give a multiplier based on how quickly you destroy stuff. Kicking butt is good for points and survival. (although Raiden IV has some milking points where this isn't always true)
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 6:25 am 


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Sometimes playing for scores is better than trying to 1cc the game, this is because most people get much better scores than their 1cc runs. These are some games that fit this prime example:

4) Giga Wing (Arcade, Dreamcast) - dying on any stage can be a nightmare here because you have no extends, luckily most players did play this game more for score.

3) Blazing Star (Neo Geo) - scoring here is also much achievable than getting a 1cc. Same thing for Giga Wing, except the last two bosses in this game are much brutal, so it's best to go rack up some points here.

2) GuwangeDash (PC, Doujin freeware) - scoring here is much better if you are playing as Twin Cobra, since it is the only fighter best known for shielding from bullets and through chaining.

1) Twinkle Star Sprites: La Petite Princesse (PS2) - I saw Mero's score on the TSS thread, and I think coin chaining is the best part here, but for one thing! You must not die to keep the coins multiplied by 10.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:39 am 


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Joined: 07 Feb 2011
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Location: Sweden
It seems like playing for score before 1cc is somethimes bad and sometimes good...In some games it will take you forever to 1cc it and you might need something to measure your succes by. And if there is no bonus-system(multipliers) then you score will grow the closer you get to that 1cc! But if there is a bonus-system you might die trying to get that extra score instead of taking the safe route.
Psyvariar is the game that I think of when I hear about score before 1cc! I tried to get as many levels as possible on the first stage and ended up dying time after time with no progress. Then I tryed to force my self to just play the game as a normal shmup...Seems like the hard part about psyvariar is that the game makes you really long for that next level up...now I know levels aren't score...but that's the game that comes to mind...

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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 9:45 am 


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I had the same problem with Mushihimesama Futari Black Label Original... First, I just concentrated on survival and got butt-raped regularly by boss Nr. 3...

Then I got how scoring worked and I couldn't help myself NOT to score. I got butt-raped regularly by boss 3 even more now, as rank got higher and higher.

I then said myself, "fuck score" until I get the 1cc, didn't look after score for a while and finally got the 1cc... Since then, I cannot play NOT for score again... Which meant, that I couldn't get the 1cc a second time, but... I don't care, because playing for Score is just plain fun!!!! And: I'm getting better the longer I play. Now, even playing for score, I manage to get to stage 5 and even larsa on a regular basis, so it is only a matter of a little bit more time and practice to get score AND the 1cc.

In hindsight, I recommend to just play the game the way you have the most fun with it.

Btw... my hiscore is 380 Millions in BL original atm... As I 1cc'ed the game, I barely made 200 millions... Go figure... :-D
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:24 am 


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I think that if your goal is to get better, there is no point in going for the 1CC before learning to score.

1CCing most shmups isn't such a hard task, what it requires is a certain knowledge of enemy positions and pattern types, a vague plan of action against them, and a bit of skill. When you got some of this knowledge, and your skill is decent, 1CCing becomes quite easy and natural. But it will still take quite a bit of time gathering that knowledge.

Scoring requires much, much more accurate knowledge of the game, and much more skill. I think it's also a lot, lot more fun, once you know what you're doing. That's why I always stick to a few games and don't bother with the rest, I have much more fun scoring in a DDP that I know very well, than screwing around trying to 1CC Ketsui that I don't know. And getting to know Ketsui enough to have as much fun as in DDP would take a long time, because of the huge amount of knowledge you need to gather before scoring well in a shmup.

So if you play for score right off the bat, 1CC will come right along. If you play for 1CC first, you will only have gathered insufficiently precise knowledge that you will have to modify, and much of which you will have no use for, later, when you want to score (such as knowledge of routes and actions that don't lead to a good scoring). Get the right routes and right knowledge right from the start, by starting to learn how to score well, if you want to get good faster.

Now for people who find trying to 1CC first fun, that's cool, play however you want, I do that at meets when I don't want to bother with scoring too much since I lack time to gather the necessary knowledge and experience. It's fun. But giving advice to try the 1CC first, as a means to get better faster, doesn't make much sense to me.

For me, going for score first, which is a task in the beginning, is a means to reach, as soon as possible, the point where I will have so much more fun : when I know how to score.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 11:53 am 


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I'll typically make exceptions for Touhou games as I tend to be apathetic about their scoring systems (I'll rush to the top to scrape up point icons, but not bother with each game's finer details as much), but when it comes to Cave games, yeah, I try to do both scoring and survival at the same time.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 12:00 pm 


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Joined: 18 Feb 2011
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Do whatever you find the most fun.

Stupid answer, I know, but probably the most correct.
There are many games I could never hope to 1cc (most of them, really), but I can still enjoy the scoring systems.


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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 1:51 pm 


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I'm always playing for score. Just can't help myself.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 2:27 pm 



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The beauty of this is there is no wrong way to go about this. Didn't we already discuss this in the other thread? Anyhow. You're going to run into obstacles when you change over to 1cc or scoring. So, do what you feel is the best and most rewarding. I personally mix the two. I play for score and try the 1cc. Its like taking two birds out with one stone if you ask me.


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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 3:25 pm 



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I normally try to play for score....
Not that I'm that good at it but I find it the most fun..
It's something else to do as well as dodging the endless barrage of bullets!!!
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2011 4:01 pm 


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Once I figure out how a scoring system works I often have a hard time ignoring it and just focusing on survival, which can be frustrating. This is one of the reasons I like Raizing games, scoring and survival are tied together completely so it's not as much of an issue (though sometimes I have a hard time just killing bosses quickly when I'm trying not to worry about points too much, find myself reflexive going into milking routines or just have a really hard time forcing myself not to).

I recently went back to DDP intending to play ONLY for survival, and I think I'm doing alright. I'm very very close to the 1-All on it, I know I'll get it before long if I just keep playing.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 6:19 pm 


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I almost always play for score before I play for a 1CC in general but usually the very first credit is just to see how far I can get.

Usually I play for as long as I feel comfortable for score and then during the last few stages for survival with bits of scoring when I can get it in safely.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 9:20 pm 


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I try to score while doing a 1cc. The scoring system is usually half the fun in how the game works if you ask me.


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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:21 pm 


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I've also noticed that it's much much easier to concentrate on just 1CC if you don't know how the scoring system works at all, This happens to me with Mushihime~sama, Since i don't know the scoring system i can enjoy the game as just survival and picking random falling gems for fun, But i know that once i figured the system mechanics i would try to score on every run
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 10:59 pm 


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What is this "survival" you are talking about? Is it edible? (・_・)
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:31 pm 


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You should try playing Battle Garegga for survival.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Thu Mar 31, 2011 11:44 pm 


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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:51 am 



Joined: 28 May 2008
Posts: 289
I say go for completion first, credit feed if necessary--just don't consider the game totally beaten after credit feeding. (However, for those shmups that restart at the beginning of a stage when continuing, it may not be worth it to actually continue.) Then play for score without continuing, regardless of whether or not the 1cc actually happens. For those games with specific scoring mechanics, I'd say work on those after learning the flow of the game.


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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 6:28 pm 


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Here's my progression chart:
1. Credit feed
2. Credit feed with other characters/ships
3. Credit feed with character of choice
4. Learn how to score Stage 1 and 2 with character
5. Either learn how to score the other stages or play for survival until 1CC

It might be beneficial to getting a 1CC first since for me, it relieves some of the pressure at the end. No need to panic when you know you've already done it before.
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 Post subject: Re: Playing for score before trying to 1CC
PostPosted: Fri Apr 01, 2011 8:29 pm 


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ratikal wrote:
Here's my progression chart:
1. Credit feed
2. Credit feed with other characters/ships
3. Credit feed with character of choice
4. Learn how to score Stage 1 and 2 with character
5. Either learn how to score the other stages or play for survival until 1CC

It might be beneficial to getting a 1CC first since for me, it relieves some of the pressure at the end. No need to panic when you know you've already done it before.


Failing to accomplish something you KNOW you can do can be demoralizing in it's own right.
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