How to get into Dreamcast shmupping?

dboeren · Post by **dboeren** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:15 pm

Hey, all! I'm an old shmups member who is just getting back into things after being out of the hobby for a couple of years, and I need some help.

Up until now, I've been solely a PCB shmupper. However, it looks like PCB prices have been on the rise and it turns out that I have a wife now (and hence less hobby cash), so I'm considering getting into the console scene for the first time. I do own a USA PS2, but apparently there aren't that many good shmuppy games for it.

I'm thinking of getting a Dreamcast, which I hear can be had for cheap. However, apparently I'll need a japanese version to play import games. So, can anyone recommend a good place for getting an inexpensive japanese Dreamcast?

Also, are the PS2 versions of shmups generally as good as the DC versions of the same games? My instincts are telling me they are not.

FRO · Post by **FRO** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:23 pm

Most on the board would tell you to purchase a Japanese DC. Personally, I'd say (if you live in the US) buy a domestic DC and either use a boot disc (like Utopia) or a mod to play Japanese shmups. I purchased my DC for $5 at a garage sale because the guy couldn't find his AV cable. I purchased a used AV cable off the internet for $6 and for another $30 had a stack of games, including US releases of Gunbird 2 and GigaWing.

BIG · Post by **BIG** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:24 pm

There are two alternatives to doing this:

1. Buy a Jpn DC. They're cheap,and imports will work flawlessly on them.
2. Mod your existing DC system.

Oh yeah,self-booting is a commonplace in the DC scene these days,if ya know what I mean,so knock yourself out

BIG-

Super Laydock · Post by **Super Laydock** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:35 pm

Maybe a bit expensive in the light of posts above, but Lik-Sang are selling refurbished pre-modded DC's for as low $79.90.Also a great starters pack with the same console + some nice extra's for $94.90 can be found here:

http://www.lik-sang.com/info.php?catego ... ts_id=4510& .

Just sell of the extras if you don't want them and you'll probably have an even cheaper newstate DC.

Sure shipping will be extra, but may be worth it if you want to save time from finding a place in your area to mod the DC and want to buy from a reliable seller.

Guardians Knight · Post by **Guardians Knight** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:41 pm

just get yourself a DC from a secondhand shop and then use a DC-X boot disc. No problems at all, will run any region discs.

I'd recommend buying original games as pirates tend to be chopped down to fit onto a cd, altho it's entirely up to you, copies are readily available if you know where to look and arnt too fussy.

nullpointer · Post by **nullpointer** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 6:42 pm

I got a cheap DC locally and the DC-X disc from play-asia, I also ordered border down/shikigami2 and psyv2 at the same time and they all work great on it..
The only problem i've ever had is with my shitty PAL only tv .. i get some annoying little black borders at the screen edge... works fine on an ntsc tv though... (Us europeans trying to be different again!)

You can also get stuff like gigawing and bangaio in your local format .. pretty cheap..

Then theres ikargua,gigawing2,zero gunner2,mars matrix,chaos field and i spose rez that are all worth gettin hold of. I'd say that the DC is my favorite system.. it certainly gets more play than my ps2 or gc

Neon · Post by **Neon** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 7:05 pm

There are several free bootdiscs you can download that will allow you to play imported games on a domestic dreamcast. I recommend the gameshark cd-x demo.

Of course I recommend modding the system more

EDIT: I've decided to sell Ole' Bessy since I have a spare DC:

http://forum.shmups.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=284

Super Laydock · Post by **Super Laydock** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 7:20 pm

BTW, should you go the bootdisc route (swapping all the time can be annoying, trust me...only go this way if you're not prepared to shelll out some extra cash to get a mod), I recommend the DC-X bootdisc.
I am not entirely sure, but I believe this is the only disc offering VGA box compatibility (read it some time ago, while doing some research for a guy who bought from on ebay. Again I am not 100% certain of it being the only one supporting this, but can vouch for it's compatibility).

If I am wrong on this, I am sure someone will correct me very soon though...

Neon · Post by **Neon** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 7:30 pm

no, gameshark cd-x allows vga.

iatneH · Post by **iatneH** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 8:55 pm

As far as I know, there isn't a single DC shmup that needed to be shrunk down to fit on a CD-R. (Baldr Force EXE did, but that's not a shmup)

Also, Utopia 1.2 will boot the Dreamcast in VGA mode, it's just that the reindeer won't display on a VGA monitor, but if you swap the disc while your monitor is displaying an out of range message, your game will load up and display properly.

Acid King · Post by **Acid King** » Tue Feb 01, 2005 9:16 pm

I use the Utopia boot disc because it's free and doing 10 seconds of work doesn't bother me when I play games for an hour or so at a time.

As for CD R bootleg DC games, I played bootlegs of Zero Gunner 2 and Ikaruga and both sounded and played like legit copies.

Guardians Knight · Post by **Guardians Knight** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 10:46 am

yeah, ok fair enough but, i compared my pirate copy of ikaruga to my original copy and there are differences aplenty. The screen had huge black boarders and the game ran slower. The music just cut out inexplicably at certain times too.

I'm not saying im against pirate copies i just think its worth bearing in mind that often pirates have short cuts taken. You can probs pick up ZG2 and Iky for maybe £20 each on ebay perhaps cheaper

BUHA · Post by **BUHA** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 5:35 pm

the dreamcast is BY FAR the best system to have on a budget

stoneroses · Post by **stoneroses** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:03 pm

I just picked up a DC two days ago myself. Right now I only have Daytona USA which rocks BTW.

I purchased it primarily for the few shooters out there mainly Giga Wing 1&2, Mars Matrix, Gunbird 2 and Bangai-O and the other DC only gems that always pop up from time to time at the used game shops. I might consider the boot disk method myself since everyone is raving about it here and picking up an import or two.

As far as the PS2 you have, I have most of the PS1/2 shooters released in the USA and although not as big a library as the Japanese counter part, there are some definate must have titles. Go back and view the post where everyone was listing their collections to find the exact listing of games for more information.

On a budget spending less than $20 you can't go wrong with the following. I spend a lot of time in used game shops and these are games i have seen in the past few weeks and the prices I remember seing for them:

Mobile Light Force 1 PS1 ($10 new, port of Gunbird)
Strikers 1945 PS1 ($15 used, awesome 1942 meets Raiden)
The Raiden Project ($13 used, every PS1/2 owner must own this game period ! The game was a launch title that came out in one of those highly-breakable long boxes so you will probablly only find a copy with the disc only)
In the Hunt PS1 (I just got a copy for $3, some call it a borderline game that is a bit slow, I love it though)
R Types PS1 ($12 used, the classic never gets old)
R Type Final PS2 ($20 used)
Gradius 3&4 PS2 ($20 used, I am seeing less and less of this one so I would pick it up soon)
Castle Shikigami 2 PS2 ($10 new, very polished for a USA translation of the quirky Japanese shooter)
Gekioh Shooting King ($7 used, I love this Raiden wanna-be)

Hope this helps man.

shariar07 · Post by **shariar07** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:49 pm

Well you can always get your PS2 modded to play those Japanese shmups like Dondopachi Dijou and Espagulda and some others too, i think it worth it since it looks like PS2 might be the next shmup console. god please bring out Raiden Fighter Series to a console port PS2 or DC.

greg · Post by **greg** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 7:56 pm

Were there any domestic Dreamcasts produced that aren't compatible with the boot discs? I bought a Japanese Dreamcast because I got tired of using the boot disc (and also because I'm a DC otaku). I got a limited edition, pink Sakura Taisen DC. It was one of the last DCs manufactured in Japan. It will not load anything burned onto a CD-R as a means of piracy prevention.

Didn't they manufacture any such units domestically late in the Dreamcast's lifespan?

Post by **nZero** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 8:52 pm

greg wrote:Didn't they manufacture any such units domestically late in the Dreamcast's lifespan?

Yes, I own one. Doesn't work with any CD/CD-R/CD-RW media, including GameShark CD-X, DC-X, Utopia, etc. A real pain in the ass when I started looking into imports.

It's modified now, direct-boots any original GD-ROM, from any region.

Super Laydock · Post by **Super Laydock** » Wed Feb 02, 2005 8:57 pm

greg wrote: Didn't they manufacture any such units domestically late in the Dreamcast's lifespan?

Apparently every dreamcast produced after October 2000 does not support the MIL-CD standard and thus won't play CD-R's (or homebrew games manufactured on CD instead of GD-ROM format for that matter).

Since you mention your the LE Sakura Taisen edition being one of the last produced DC models, it makes sence that it's not reading CD-R's.

Be glad though as using CD-R's in the DC actually contributes to a shorter lifespan of the system apparently.

stoneroses · Post by **stoneroses** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 5:44 pm

Question: does anyone know how you can tell when your DC was made, I just picked mine up used. I know on some sites like modchipman.com they show you the serial number and tell you which version of a PS2 you have.

Any help or links would be greatly appreciated!

Neon · Post by **Neon** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 6:07 pm

a 2 circled on the bottom, you're fuckt.

a 1 or 0 circled, you're good.

FRO · Post by **FRO** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 7:21 pm

stoneroses1969 wrote: Strikers 1945 PS1 ($15 used, awesome 1942 meets Raiden)
Gekioh Shooting King ($7 used, I love this Raiden wanna-be)

Just so you know, the US release of "Strikers 1945" is actually "Strikers 1945 II" - the same as the Japanese import S1945II that I have on my Saturn.

Also, Gekioh: Shooting King is actually "Shienryu" (another Japanese arcade/Saturn shmup) with extra play modes (though no TATE I'm aware of). And yes, the Gekioh game is a good buy, I found mine still in the plastic just last month for under $5.

dementia · Post by **dementia** » Thu Feb 03, 2005 11:19 pm

stoneroses1969 wrote:...Giga Wing 1&2, Mars Matrix, Gunbird 2 and Bangai-O and the other DC only gems...

Gunbird 2 is availiable on PS2 and Bakuretsu Muteki Bangaioh is availaible on N64.