Prolific but notoriously poor shmup developers query

[Samildanach]

Much is said about the prolific famous shmups devs such as Toaplan, Cave, Raizing, Tecnosoft and the rest as they have given us so many awesome games over the years. I was wondering (rather oddly quite frankly) if there has been an equally prolific but benighted dev who has fairly consistently churned out dull or dreadful shmups, especially back in the day when there was a drive to port arcade hits onto every machine possible.
One or two developed shmup games don't count; they have to have been merciless in their attempts to get poor game after game out to unsuspecting gamers of the day. Anyone know of such a developer, or are we lucky to have had reasonable quality from all prolific shmup devs?

[o.pwuaioc]

Micronics comes to mind.

[Samildanach]

Micronics comes to mind.

Thanks for the reply, I knew there had to be at least one out there. I can have a bit of fun looking up their games to see how bad they are.

If there are any other reasonable consistently rubbish devs out there that anyone knows about, then this is the place for them!

[OmegaFlareX]

Hm, maybe all the Korean AC devs. Afega, Philko, SunA, some others I'm forgetting. Dooyong was probably the best of the bunch but that's not saying much.

Some bad Japanese AC shmups - Meta Fox/Arbalester (Seta), Sand Scorpion (Face). Orca's shmups (Espial, Zodiack, The Percussor, Funky Bee, etc.) weren't that great. Some say Kyugo's are bad, but I liked S.R.D. Mission.

[mamboFoxtrot]

I'm guessing indie/doujin stuff is probably not what you're looking for, but nonetheless I do feel like RAYHAWK on DLsite bears some kind of special mention. Absolutely mind-boggling number of incomprehensible psychedelic "rainbow bismuth" looking kusoge shooters, frequently on sale for like 10 cents each.

Otherwise I'm struggling to think of another prolific developer who's games are really DREADED, rather than just being considered a bit mediocre or flawed.

[Samildanach]

Hm, maybe all the Korean AC devs. Afega, Philko, SunA, some others I'm forgetting. Dooyong was probably the best of the bunch but that's not saying much.

Some bad Japanese AC shmups - Meta Fox/Arbalester (Seta), Sand Scorpion (Face). Orca's shmups (Espial, Zodiack, The Percussor, Funky Bee, etc.) weren't that great. Some say Kyugo's are bad, but I liked S.R.D. Mission.

Interesting how Orca folded, became Crux, released the half decent Gyrodine, also folded, then became Toaplan. Though I gather some of Toaplan's finest only joined Orca at the point of its demise.

[BIL]

Micronics comes to mind.

Ironically, for all their shitty FC conversions of classic arcade titles (I think Kyuukyoku Tiger just about heaves itself up into "aight" tier... 1942, Ikari and Dogosoken are pure shite), they later worked with Shin Nakamura on the original Sonic Wings, an STG with a historic legacy via Psikyo. Sort of a minor redemption arc, haha. Seems they could produce passable work if a talented director stood over them with a katana and a live grenade clenched in his teeth (so even if you kill him you get blown up too)

[Samildanach]

I'm guessing indie/doujin stuff is probably not what you're looking for, but nonetheless I do feel like RAYHAWK on DLsite bears some kind of special mention. Absolutely mind-boggling number of incomprehensible psychedelic "rainbow bismuth" looking kusoge shooters, frequently on sale for like 10 cents each.

Otherwise I'm struggling to think of another prolific developer who's games are really DREADED, rather than just being considered a bit mediocre or flawed.

Still worth a look for the comedy. Thanks

[Samildanach]

Micronics comes to mind.

Ironically, for all their shitty FC conversions of classic arcade titles (I think Kyuukyoku Tiger just about heaves itself up into "aight" tier... 1942, Ikari and Dogosoken are pure shite), they later worked with Shin Nakamura on the original Sonic Wings, an STG with a historic legacy via Psikyo. Sort of a minor redemption arc, haha. Seems they could produce passable work if a talented director stood over them with a katana and a live grenade clenched in his teeth (so even if you kill him you get blown up too)

Heh heh. Maybe they were just ran out of different ways of getting it wrong.

[BIL]

I really wonder... their FC stuff, even the relatively decent Kyuukyoku Tiger, has an unmistakably choppy framerate which, along with their jarring use of pastels on flat dirt/metal backgrounds, and *paf paf paf* BGM/SFX, forms an unholy stylistic trinity. Like a hideous inversion of the killer style demonstrated by first-rate FC teams like Konami's Umechan crew and Technos's Miracle Kidz. Try Capcom's own FC 1943 after Micronics' 1942... it must be the STG equivalent of autoerotic asphyxiation ).

This characteristic dreck largely cleared up in their 16bit conversions. MD Atomic Robokid runs ok, IIRC. I wonder if the extra processing power compensated for their godawful coding, assuming the worst offenders weren't finally sentenced to sudoku.

OTOH, their SFC Raiden is anaemic, without even comparing it to Hudson's lovable PCE/CD versions and Seibu's own rock-solid MD cart. So whatever plagued them a generation prior clearly hung about. I never played it, but I remember hearing their SFC conversion of UPL's Acrobat Mission has half its goddamn weapons broken, too.

It seems they worked on Sonic Wings' SFC cart, as well, which again is suspiciously competent, I'm assuming due to Nakamura's presence. Ultimately, they're one of the few devs I sincerely dislike - gobbled up lots of IPs that might've led to classic FC carts in better hands, ala Konami, Technos, SNK and Capcom's own in-house work.

[ACSeraph]

Sand Scorpion (Face)

This game really is a dumpster fire. I still remember having to learn to 1cc this atrocity in one of Trap's STGTs years ago.

I really wonder... their FC stuff, even the relatively decent Kyuukyoku Tiger, has an unmistakably choppy framerate (try Capcom's FC 1943 after their 1942... it must be the STG equivalent of autoerotic asphyxiation )

I actually tried really hard to clear 1942 FC a few years back and I could never do it because in the last few stages the frame rate drops so badly that it barely reads your shot inputs. Basically it prevented me from firing fast enough to kill anything and I game overed around stage 28. To this day that run ranks as one of my all-time worst shmup experiences.

[BIL]

That's the Micronics experience alright I was once diabolically tempted to pick up FC Ikari and Dogo, just because they're the friggin only console releases of those games, and they at least have nice boxarts... just could not justify it though, the AC's calculated, tactical action is mongled beyond recognition. Meanwhile, SNK's own Guevara demonstrates true nous and artistry, ditching the rotary death-grind for simpler, blitzkrieg-paced POW rescues.

Thankfully, as with so many orphaned AC classics, Hamster has saved the day, and now everyone can experience the best Rambo game and its sword-obsessed companion piece, which Predators totally ripped off a quarter-century later. Watch out, buff bad dudes! If you're too badass, aliens will kidnap you for their Killing Game Show!

Not wishing to big up FC Kyuukyoku too much ITT: beware of zako heli equipped with ZeroShift HyperDrive modules. You might think you're safe behind a wall of vulcan fire, until a kamikaze motherfucker hits Compression Space and catapults a missile of dead meat and gunmetal into your fuckin face.

Other than that though, I find it surprisingly likeable (and again, the boxart's rendition of classic Toaplan sniper tank hell is killer... I'm such a sucker ). If there's one good thing about their FC "efforts," it's that they can be surprisingly faithful to AC level designs, meaning they at least have pace and concision (just not the mechanics to go with that... contra Robert Paulson, two outta three is, in fact, bad!). In Ikari and Dogosoken's meagre defenses, they at least attempted to add significant "home arrange" content. Again though, the chassis is busted, and everything else crashes down. I actually kinda like FC Ikari's exclusive knife powerup (lets you bump-kill zako, Ys-style)... ah fuck, my Micronics Appreciate is showing.

[BrianC]

That's the Micronics experience alright I was once diabolically tempted to pick up FC Ikari and Dogo, just because they're the friggin only console releases of those games.

Ikari Warriors is on the 7800 and 2600. The 7800 version is definitely better than the NES version, but pales in comparison to the arcade. The 2600 was from the same programmer as the 2600 Commando and it shows. Somewhat impressive for the system, but missing power ups, aside from the tank. Both were done by Imagineering Inc., which was made up of former Activision programmers.

[BIL]

Ack! My historic Nihoncentric blind spot strikes again. Good to hear it wasn't just the FC trainwreck flying the flag all these years.

[BrianC]

There are also a few computer ports, including the MSX Ikari port from SNK themselves.

[BIL]

Yeah, the MSX one catches my eye - along with Contra, Dracula, and the whole Konami STG catalogue, it's one I may get into if the MSX bug ever bites me. The bloodier death animations are an interesting way to economise the grim, gritty aesthetic Obada-san was going for, with the arcade player/zakos' plaintively spiralling collapses.

I should also mention for completism's sake that Ikari, Dogo and Guevara are technically on PSP, via SNK Arcade Classics Vol. 0 (or whatever it was called) - but these games' brand of tactical topdown is so specific, the collection's sluggish rotary jams 'em up. They're calculatedly heavy-handling shooters by design - porting issues will push them over the line into outright drudge. ACA's got pinpoint accuracy and is certainly the best you'll get without a real LS-32.

[Sumez]

Do Micronics count when they are being prolific specifically for being bad?
It's definitely a stretch of the term considering they were never credited for their work, and haven't really entered public consciousness until recent years.

[BIL]

Yeah, I consider them more parasites/bottom-feeders of the arcade industry, than a genuine creative kusoforce (not to let Capcom, SNK, Taito et al off the hook entirely - takes two to tango, after all. Micronics must've offered some rock-bottom contracting rates).

Amusing that Konami and Technos seemed to avoid them like the goddamn plague, to say nothing of Namco. imagine them being assigned one of the FC shooter triple crown, a Gradius or Twinbee or Xevious... might've altered history if those landmarks had been Micro-mongled.

Had they been cranking out original works of equally shitty quality to the majority of their FC/NES catalogue, they'd be a veritable kusocolossus.

[o.pwuaioc]

Micronics comes to mind.

Ironically, for all their shitty FC conversions of classic arcade titles (I think Kyuukyoku Tiger just about heaves itself up into "aight" tier... 1942, Ikari and Dogosoken are pure shite), they later worked with Shin Nakamura on the original Sonic Wings, an STG with a historic legacy via Psikyo. Sort of a minor redemption arc, haha. Seems they could produce passable work if a talented director stood over them with a katana and a live grenade clenched in his teeth (so even if you kill him you get blown up too)

Man, I love Sonic Wings, so this blows my mind. It doesn't have the stench of Micronics anywhere near it. So the rumors of some college dude who overpromised and underdeveloped for dirt cheap isn't a real story then, huh?

Yeah, I consider them more parasites/bottom-feeders of the arcade industry, than a genuine creative kusoforce (not to let Capcom, SNK, Taito et al off the hook entirely - takes two to tango, after all. Micronics must've offered some rock-bottom contracting rates).

Amusing that Konami and Technos seemed to avoid them like the goddamn plague, to say nothing of Namco. imagine them being assigned one of the FC shooter triple crown, a Gradius or Twinbee or Xevious... might've altered history if those landmarks had been Micro-mongled.

What a nightmare scenario!

[Shatterhand]

Have you guys ever seen the Capcom, Taito and SNK ports on european computers?

I am pretty sure those companies didn't give a damn about the quality of their home ports. They just got the licensing money and fuck it. Sometimes you'd get developers who wanted to be proud of their jobs, and sometimes... not. Dempa was a japanese developer who made some *really* good home ports back in the day, but I'd best most of them had to deal with shitty support and stupid deadlines from a suit-guy who knew shitty about videogames but wanted the $.

Konami actually handled their console ports in-house, that's why their home games are pretty good. Their MSX games were waaay above anything else any other company put on that system.

But Konami USA also out-sourced computer ports to other devs... so, again, check out stuff like Castlevania and Super C on amiga to see some really dreadful ports. Thank god they cancelled a lot of Amiga stuff, so we didn't get (probably) awful ports of Ajax, The Simpsons and Metal Gear.

Same thing with Namco... did their japanese home ports in-house ( For japanese computers and consoles), but they had no qualms in licensing their games to european publishers. Take a look at Rolling Thunder on Amiga ( a 16 bits that could make Mega-Drive level games) and tell me how the hell that was acceptable as something commercially sold?


-

I believe MSX Ikari Warriors is the best home version of the game released at the time. I am no big fan of Ikari Warriors though, but its indeed a very solid port. It was produced by SNK but I really doubt it was coded by them, mosty likely it was out-sourced for some small japanese studio (Pretty much like MSX R-Type isn't made by Irem even though it's only their name that shows up in game and all media of the game)

[OmegaFlareX]

Have you guys ever seen the Capcom, Taito and SNK ports on european computers?

I am pretty sure those companies didn't give a damn about the quality of their home ports. They just got the licensing money and fuck it.

Maybe not for western PCs, sure, I mostly agree there were no fucks given. I think some of the Bubble Bobble ones looked ok, and Slap Fight was never ported to anything but PCs. But for Famicom, at least Capcom took their ball from Micronics and went home. 1942 and GnG were the only ports they let them butcher, and thankfully handled the rest themselves. Compare those two with NES Commando, 1943, Gun.Smoke, and Trojan.

[Samildanach]

A great example is the terrible Darius ports (Darius+) for the Amiga, Atari ST and ZS Spectrum. Barely resembling the Taito developed games, these western developed outsourced monstrosities definitely sit at the bottom of the pile when it comes to all the various Darius games and ports.

[pja]

Amusing that Konami and Technos seemed to avoid them like the goddamn plague, to say nothing of Namco. imagine them being assigned one of the FC shooter triple crown, a Gradius or Twinbee or Xevious... might've altered history if those landmarks had been Micro-mongled.

I remember watching some Jeremy Parish's videos (the ones chronicling NES releases) and he speculated that it could be as simple as the fact that SNK and Capcom were Osaka-based, unlike the other companies (wikipedia search tells me that e.g. Konami and Namco are Tokyo-based). So maybe Micronics was just nearby.

Mind you that might be complete bullshit, it's just something I vaguely recall

[Shatterhand]

A great example is the terrible Darius ports (Darius+) for the Amiga, Atari ST and ZS Spectrum. Barely resembling the Taito developed games, these western developed outsourced monstrosities definitely sit at the bottom of the pile when it comes to all the various Darius games and ports.

Darius +, 1943, UN Squadron ... those games are awful on Amiga. There are some ports that are mediocre like Flying Shark... not a good job, but not exactly dreadful either. But some were really impossible to explain.

How the heck could someome botch 1943 so badly in a system that could easily handle the game?

[BIL]

Amusing that Konami and Technos seemed to avoid them like the goddamn plague, to say nothing of Namco. imagine them being assigned one of the FC shooter triple crown, a Gradius or Twinbee or Xevious... might've altered history if those landmarks had been Micro-mongled.

I remember watching some Jeremy Parish's videos (the ones chronicling NES releases) and he speculated that it could be as simple as the fact that SNK and Capcom were Osaka-based, unlike the other companies (wikipedia search tells me that e.g. Konami and Namco are Tokyo-based). So maybe Micronics was just nearby.

Mind you that might be complete bullshit, it's just something I vaguely recall

Haha, reminds me of IREM's guys getting hometown support from SNK, after their company's first incarnation closed up shop. Except with shitty FC carts instead of rock-solid AES ones! The Lord giveth and taketh away, etc etc

Now that I think back, Micronics also developed the third, FC-original game of IREM's Kaiketsu Yanchamaru/Kid Niki series. Never tried it, myself... maybe there's some truth in the Osaka thing.

[Marc]

A great example is the terrible Darius ports (Darius+) for the Amiga, Atari ST and ZS Spectrum. Barely resembling the Taito developed games, these western developed outsourced monstrosities definitely sit at the bottom of the pile when it comes to all the various Darius games and ports.

Haha, in fairness, nobody ever really had any business trying port Darius to a Spectrum. I think they saw the R-Type conversion and thought 'oh look, we could do that'. Erm, no. You can't.

Hell even the same game could end up in a very different state - Salamander C64 is surprisingly competent, Salamander Spectrum is piss-poor.

[DJ Incompetent]

Whoever makes Sky Force, believes in iterating on a dollar-store-Raiden "anniversary" "reloaded", then spreading it to every operating system every made.

[Samildanach]

Whoever makes Sky Force, believes in iterating on a dollar-store-Raiden "anniversary" "reloaded", then spreading it to every operating system every made.

I think most of us here will agree on what we think of the Sky Force games, but other plus side they could be praised in helping to get a new generation of gamers potentially interested in shmups. Going straight in with a Cave game or Battle Garegga is probably not going to work with a newbie. Sky Force requires grinding to succeed, which at least teaches somebody to work at the game, rather than credit feed to the end and drop it in one go.

[Shatterhand]

A great example is the terrible Darius ports (Darius+) for the Amiga, Atari ST and ZS Spectrum. Barely resembling the Taito developed games, these western developed outsourced monstrosities definitely sit at the bottom of the pile when it comes to all the various Darius games and ports.

Haha, in fairness, nobody ever really had any business trying port Darius to a Spectrum. I think they saw the R-Type conversion and thought 'oh look, we could do that'. Erm, no. You can't.

Hell even the same game could end up in a very different state - Salamander C64 is surprisingly competent, Salamander Spectrum is piss-poor.

If Spectrum got a rather acceptable version of R-Type, I really think Darius could had justice on it too.

It's just that Darius+ game for those computers is abysmal. It's not a port of any Darius games, it's like a new game inspired in Darius and is utterly, utterly fucking horrible. And not just the Spectrum version... the Amiga version that could *easily* handle something like Sagaia on the Master System, is na awful game. It's not that's bad programmed or the hardware not handlng what's thrown at it properly. It's just a terribly ill-designed game.

[Samildanach]

A great example is the terrible Darius ports (Darius+) for the Amiga, Atari ST and ZS Spectrum. Barely resembling the Taito developed games, these western developed outsourced monstrosities definitely sit at the bottom of the pile when it comes to all the various Darius games and ports.

Haha, in fairness, nobody ever really had any business trying port Darius to a Spectrum. I think they saw the R-Type conversion and thought 'oh look, we could do that'. Erm, no. You can't.

Hell even the same game could end up in a very different state - Salamander C64 is surprisingly competent, Salamander Spectrum is piss-poor.

If Spectrum got a rather acceptable version of R-Type, I really think Darius could had justice on it too.

It's just that Darius+ game for those computers is abysmal. It's not a port of any Darius games, it's like a new game inspired in Darius and is utterly, utterly fucking horrible. And not just the Spectrum version... the Amiga version that could *easily* handle something like Sagaia on the Master System, is na awful game. It's not that's bad programmed or the hardware not handlng what's thrown at it properly. It's just a terribly ill-designed game.

And to cap it all, the reward for beating Darius+ is an ending that is an ad for another of the dev's games. How about no?