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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:52 am 


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Sumez wrote:
Final Fantasy X is a good game. I can easily see why it's off putting, and when it came out it also took me some time to come to terms with it - but aside from FF8, the series had never let me down at that point, so I pulled through and I'm great I did.

I'm pretty disappointed that the series ditched the ATB system after that game though, cause FFX is objectively the best implementation of that system, by a long shot (ignoring the fact that you can hardly call it "ATB" since it ditches the gauge).

Also, Blitzball is stupid. Every game is: 1. Get the ball to Tidus, 2. Jecht Shot. No challenge :|

Combat is so good, it blows my mind.

They've really hit that aspect out of the park


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:02 am 


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Well there's one exception IMO - I really would have preferred at least four characters in your party for combat. I felt like combat got way too simplified from having only three characters in 7, and always wondered why they'd go that route.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:09 am 


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Sumez wrote:

I'm pretty disappointed that the series ditched the ATB system after that game though, cause FFX is objectively the best implementation of that system, by a long shot (ignoring the fact that you can hardly call it "ATB" since it ditches the gauge).



How can it be ATB, when it is turn-based?
Meaning nothing would progress, if one wouldn't make a decision.
X-2, yes. That's ATB
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:17 am 


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Sumez wrote:
Well there's one exception IMO - I really would have preferred at least four characters in your party for combat. I felt like combat got way too simplified from having only three characters in 7, and always wondered why they'd go that route.

Maybe because four would have meant too great a variety of spells, skills and eqp/attributes in the player's favor (and therefore the need to oppose more challenging, better-designed enemies)

Also moar polygons during battles was probably beyond what the production could afford at the time of VII.

Then as they felt comfortable with that kind of battle setup they decided to keep it for future games...just guessing.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 11:40 am 


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Sumez wrote:
Well there's one exception IMO - I really would have preferred at least four characters in your party for combat. I felt like combat got way too simplified from having only three characters in 7, and always wondered why they'd go that route.

I don't agree, I think the switching and 3 only is great. Love the "can't have everything at once. must find the best compromise" gameplay. It makes you rake your brain and when you find a good strategy then it is very rewarding(gameply mechanics 101 : make the player feel SMarTTTTT). I personnally love management of the sort. But then again I'm a huge Resident Evil fan


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 12:46 pm 


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The problem is that 3 characters is so low that there is very little room for tactics. You got one guy on healing duty, and one on damage duty, and then a third on either of those. You don't really have any arms to spare for more creative combinations of spells and effects.

Ronyn wrote:
How can it be ATB, when it is turn-based?
Meaning nothing would progress, if one wouldn't make a decision.
X-2, yes. That's ATB


ATB is essentially turn based, FFX is exactly the mechanics from ATB, except time stops whenever you input a command, and moves instantly to the next character who has a turn - everyone still has a hidden "ATB" gauge.
The only thing that really makes FFX different from classic ATB is that it does away with some of the system's major flaws:
1. Waiting time while nothing is happening. (this is the dumbest thing ever)
2. The length of an attack animation actually influencing gameplay

Whether you want to actually call it "ATB" doesn't really matter to me. What matters is that it's essentially an improvement in every way.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:14 pm 


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ATB means that the turns aren't equally distributed. I. e. : a quicker character will have a few more turns over the spawn of a long battle, than a slower character.

This is unrelated to the fact that time freezes(or not) when you're inputing your command
So yes, FFX has ATB.


Last edited by FinalBaton on Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:20 pm 


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Sumez wrote:
The problem is that 3 characters is so low that there is very little room for tactics. You got one guy on healing duty, and one on damage duty, and then a third on either of those. You don't really have any arms to spare for more creative combinations of spells and effects.

Think Sweet Home on the NES : it's harder for the player to only have a few skills available at one time instead of all of 'em, yes. But when you find a combination of characters that work well for a dungeon stretch/boss battle, then it is WAY more rewarding when you get through.


Last edited by FinalBaton on Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:21 pm 


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I always thought HOMM3 had the best initiative system. Units go in the order of their speed, but if they wait they go to the bottom of the list in reverse order. That way the fastest unit can have two moves in a row, but to do so you need to give slow units a chance to adjust and prepare, so super speedy units aren't flat out superior to the slow ones.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 1:25 pm 


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Sumez wrote:
Notice how Auron's voice doesn't suck? Because you can't see his mouth.

Yeah, i had that realization some years ago. :)
Some great names in the English dub, sure. Still, i think James Arnold Taylor was a bit weak here. He vastly improved after his role as Tidus. I think he nailed Guy Gardner in Batman Brave and the Bold just right, imo.
As for John DiMaggio...Well, if he was told to play a religious zealot with a Jamaican accent, he sure played it right. :wink:
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:13 pm 


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Playing alot of Battlefield 2 as of late before the semester rolls up again.

Ever since the Gamespy servers had closed down, there's a few servers up to replace GS and the game (along with the expansion packs) are now free to play.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 10:04 pm 


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Grabbed Volgarr the Viking on a Steam sale and having a blast with it


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:05 am 


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Just finished I Have No Mouth And I Must Scream. The game has a few bugs but thankfully nothing gamebreaking. And the story is great. If you enjoyed the book then you should check it out sometime.

Leandro wrote:
Grabbed Volgarr the Viking on a Steam sale and having a blast with it


Volgarr was the main reason I got myself a Steam account. Really loved it.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:13 am 


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FinalBaton wrote:
ATB means that the turns aren't equally distributed. I. e. : a quicker character will have a few more turns over the spawn of a long battle, than a slower character.



Sumez wrote:
Whether you want to actually call it "ATB" doesn't really matter to me.


Ah. Got it. In that ATB-order.
Thanks.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 12:05 pm 


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started playing king's field 1 JP. holy shit, the textures! i'm finding it a lot harder to navigate my way round and remember where i've been than in KF2. i just feel totally lost all of the time haha.

the run button is definitely missed.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 1:45 pm 


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For what it's worth, the 1.3 update for No Man's Sky just dropped:

https://youtu.be/5328iuzHw-w

It's not on gog yet so I haven't tried it and I'm still super skeptical, but it looks like they're finally implementing basic things the game was missing like random mission generation and low-altitude flight instead of brand new features nobody wanted like interior decorating or dune buggies. The one thing that really caught my eye was "conflict levels" in systems. Is this going to be giant fleet vs fleet conflicts like in the E3 live footage, or is it just going to be the pirate spawn rate?


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 3:25 pm 


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Ah, that FFX praise warms the cockles of my heart. the DQ discussion too.. I may have said this before but it's nice to agree with Sumez now and then :p

Immryr wrote:
started playing king's field 1 JP. holy shit, the textures! i'm finding it a lot harder to navigate my way round and remember where i've been than in KF2. i just feel totally lost all of the time haha.

the run button is definitely missed.


That droning thudding music. Ah that reminds me I need to give my final thoughts on Shadow Tower. Not now though.
I seem to remember maps being more useful in that game than they were in 2.

As for me I'm replaying Red Dead Redemption and enjoying that more than my now completed virgin play of Super Metroid, blasphemy eh?
Also some Digital Devil Story: Megami Tensei - the SFC New Testament version, on the side.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 2:58 am 


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ninja gaiden 3 nes, i've heard this is the hardest nes ng and that could be true, but it's far easier than say volgarr the viking, at least first 3 levels. third is probably considered the hardest becouse you can't continue infinitely, like i believe you could in first two, but aiming for 1cc i don't care much for that.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:24 am 


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Blinge wrote:
Ah, that FFX praise warms the cockles of my heart. the DQ discussion too.. I may have said this before but it's nice to agree with Sumez now and then


I need to give it a play. I have it for PS4 in the X/X2 collection.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 3:28 am 



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Blinge wrote:
Digital Devil Story: Megami Tensei - the SFC New Testament version, on the side.


Are the FC and SFC MegaTen games accessible without a manual? I know they've been fan-translated. If not, what reference would you suggest that isn't a complete walkthrough?
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 5:55 am 


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Just got through a pretty decent stretch without ANY ink ribbons in my inventory :shock: in RE : Code Veronica. I just found some now.

Holy shit, that was nerve wracking :lol: My heart was beating pretty frickin' fast, lol
I was sitting on the very edge of my couch and when I found those ink ribbons, I kid you not my muscles instantly relaxed throughout my whole body and I kicked back and left out a huge sigh of relief, haha

HUGE shot of endorphins right there.
precious, precious ink ribbons


Last edited by FinalBaton on Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:09 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:03 am 


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^ :mrgreen:. I should get back to RE series! never played past 2.

WelshMegalodon wrote:
Blinge wrote:
Digital Devil Story: Megami Tensei - the SFC New Testament version, on the side.


Are the FC and SFC MegaTen games accessible without a manual? I know they've been fan-translated. If not, what reference would you suggest that isn't a complete walkthrough?


I'm using the fan patch for SFC, I assume there's one for FC.
if you can't find patch PM me yo.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 6:13 am 


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Same, I hadn't played past 2 either. I'm having a friggin' blast with RE:CV at the moment, it's excellent so far. I'm pretty impressed with it. So classic RE goodness.

I think I might like it as much as 2 so far, and 2 is one of my fave games of all time


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:24 am 



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Vanquish Tactical Challenges.

The campaign is lame even on hard mode (less AR with the same fights basically just turns it into another cover shooter...), but the TCs are amazing. This is the game I was expecting. If only the campaign played anything like this.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:26 am 


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i acually haven't played RE 2 yet despite the fact i love 1&REmake. i also have code veronica on the dreamcast, but tank controls with an analogue stick is fucking awful so i didn't get very far when i tried playing that.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 2:21 pm 


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Play RECV using the Dreamcast controller's d-pad, Immryr :mrgreen: it's MUCH better than with the analog stick, I've tried that and it is indeed awful.

(btw I have no gripe with tank controls in RE ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ I find them very precise and allow you to turn arround without advancing in that direction, which is safer when zombies are close-by since it prevents you from accidently bumping into them. Couple that with the auto-aim and that works fine for me, I've adapted to it just fine. RECV even adds a quick-turn(180°) control)

2 is frickin' amazing, you gotta play that!


Last edited by FinalBaton on Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:06 pm, edited 7 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 4:35 pm 


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I genuinely like the gamecube's analog. Prefer it to the horrific Dpad that's for sure.
Works with REmake very well.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 7:58 pm 


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wizkid wrote:
ninja gaiden 3 nes, i've heard this is the hardest nes ng and that could be true, but it's far easier than say volgarr the viking, at least first 3 levels. third is probably considered the hardest becouse you can't continue infinitely, like i believe you could in first two, but aiming for 1cc i don't care much for that.


The limited continues definitely scared off some people, since training the game is a lot harder, but in general it's a pretty hard game.
I can't really compare the game with the first two, since I never really put the required amount of time into the US release, but it's definitely not just the amount of continues. The Japanese version has infinite continues like the other games, and on my first, blind playthrough of the game I didn't even use one, the game is that easy. So there are a lot of little changes here and there, mostly in the damage scales and items available to you, that made the US release a lot harder.


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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 9:10 pm 


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Obscura wrote:
Vanquish Tactical Challenges.

The campaign is lame even on hard mode (less AR with the same fights basically just turns it into another cover shooter...), but the TCs are amazing. This is the game I was expecting. If only the campaign played anything like this.


The Tactical Challenges are indeed amazing, and are incredibly fun to play, but Hard mode doesn't change how long you can stay in AR. It only ups the difficulty slightly (the biggest adjustment is you take a bit more damage), but Hard mode isn't a huge jump from Normal mode.

You probably meant to say God Hard, which vastly alters things due to longer AR emergency cooldown, enemies dealing way more damage, etc. However, I wouldn't say God Hard "turns it into another cover shooter". I do wish there was a mode with God Hard's additional enemies and difficulty without the reduced AR (something in between Hard and God Hard) because of how brutal the jump in difficulty is... but God Hard is still set apart from other average cover shooters by the insane mobility you have and your incredibly useful moveset. It's brutally unforgiving, and enemies are super aggressive but the dodging capabilities you have and the ability to slide from cover to cover, etc, still sets it vastly apart from say Gears of War where you're probably hiding and resorting to blind firing.
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 Post subject: Re: What [not shmup] game are you playing now?
PostPosted: Sun Aug 13, 2017 10:20 pm 


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Obscura wrote:
Vanquish Tactical Challenges.

The campaign is lame even on hard mode (less AR with the same fights basically just turns it into another cover shooter...), but the TCs are amazing. This is the game I was expecting. If only the campaign played anything like this.


Once you play god hard for a bit you realize AR is more of a crutch to make aiming easier. Without it you can still iframe evade through attacks, punish openings and keep taking enemies down while on the move. So sticking to the cover shooter playstyle is optional and on you (probably missing time bonus as well result, and shotgun wont seem that good)

The game and campaign are far from perfect but nothing is preventing you from taking that knowledge from TCs back and playing through it in the fun way you imagine. Well apart from the slow autoscroller bits.. On God Hard enemies have different AI and new attacks so its quite different and worth trying. The final boss is a different beast on that mode while it's a big letdown on others.


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