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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 6:24 pm 



Joined: 14 Sep 2016
Posts: 16
FinalBaton wrote:
That's some pretty nice upscaling of 240p from that display! I wonder if all the CMX Pioneer display perform like this with 240p...

Haven't seen a 607CMX model around here but I've seen other CMX ones


Funny thing.. another CMX has shown up on craigslist in my town! 50" with probably no input expansion more hours, but still.

Yes I am very impressed with the 240p upscaling. Does great!

Here are some more shots of the difference between dot by dot and 4:3 for PC gaming. It doesn't use much screen real estate, but still a larger picture than a quality VGA monitor. May not look like much, but I can't express enough how good it looks.


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 9:48 pm 


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Joined: 06 Feb 2005
Posts: 254
Location: Italy
Jfonzy wrote:
No filter, just "dot by dot" screen size setting. It really does look incredible, like you are playing on a really detailed needlework or something.

Yeah it's kinda like a CRT's shadow mask but with bigger and more focused dots (btw "dot by dot" stands for no scaling, 1:1 pixel mapping). It makes sense though - with a 720p native res the pixel pitch of a 60" panel will be quite large. Certainly a fascinating look :)


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 09, 2017 10:20 pm 


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Joined: 08 Mar 2015
Posts: 1950
Location: Québec City
Jfonzy wrote:
FinalBaton wrote:
That's some pretty nice upscaling of 240p from that display! I wonder if all the CMX Pioneer display perform like this with 240p...

Haven't seen a 607CMX model around here but I've seen other CMX ones


Funny thing.. another CMX has shown up on craigslist in my town! 50" with probably no input expansion more hours, but still.

Yes I am very impressed with the 240p upscaling. Does great!

Here are some more shots of the difference between dot by dot and 4:3 for PC gaming. It doesn't use much screen real estate, but still a larger picture than a quality VGA monitor. May not look like much, but I can't express enough how good it looks.

The second to last pic looks the best to me.

Looks like there's a 50 incher of those (507CMX), I'll keep on the lookout. Would like to get one


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 12:47 am 


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Joined: 27 Apr 2015
Posts: 344
Location: Bellingham, WA
Is there a way to add scanlines to a 240p image on his plasma in chain with his RGBs cable?

Most scanlines generators I have seen work with 31khz.
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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 5:47 am 


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Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 10513
Location: Germany
On a 15khz 240p signal you simply don't have any spare pixel lines to cover. Also on a 768p panel you never can display proper scanlines. The scaling engine is never good enough to rescale a scanlined 480p image to the panel's resolution.

And after all the plasma's cell structure is unique enough, so you don't really need scanlines in addition to that...


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:59 am 



Joined: 14 Sep 2016
Posts: 16
Fudoh wrote:
On a 15khz 240p signal you simply don't have any spare pixel lines to cover. Also on a 768p panel you never can display proper scanlines. The scaling engine is never good enough to rescale a scanlined 480p image to the panel's resolution.

And after all the plasma's cell structure is unique enough, so you don't really need scanlines in addition to that...


Yeah the math doesn't really work out- I guess the generator would need to be at 15khz. Not familiar with them. But if anyone wants to let me borrow one to try, I'd be happy to report on it.

Another thing I can try is emulation on my PC with a scanline filter on. Kind of overkill.. 240p emulation > HDMI out > DVI adapter > 768 plasma..

But I'm with Fudoh, I'm enjoying having a different way to display games on native hardware in RGB without scanlines.


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:16 pm 


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Joined: 16 Jan 2014
Posts: 622
Really nice photos. The "dot by dot" setting sounds intriguing-- does it render 240p images very small, as true dot by dot would?


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 1:38 am 



Joined: 14 Sep 2016
Posts: 16
Josh128 wrote:
Really nice photos. The "dot by dot" setting sounds intriguing-- does it render 240p images very small, as true dot by dot would?


Unfortunately, Dot by dot is only selectable for the PC inputs. But yeah, even if you could do it for 240p, it would be tiny. Now if I could go console > RGB > line doubler > VGA, we might be on to something. As long as the line doubler doesn't introduce lag. First I just need to get a VGA box for my dreamcast to try..


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 6:04 pm 


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Joined: 27 Apr 2015
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Location: Bellingham, WA
For your purposes a line tripler would be handy. 240x3 = 720.

The OSSC does a fine job if it is compatible with your set. Line doublers are more for vga or 640x480 sets. You have a set pixel resolution of 1366 x 768.

I'm not sure how 480p sources would even be handled at that native res.
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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:35 pm 


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Joined: 11 May 2015
Posts: 500
Location: America
Jfonzy wrote:
Overall I am very happy so far. The Genesis RGBs cables are the only ones I have, so I can't test RGB on other consoles yet.

It's not shown here, but I did test the PS2 over component via RGB inputs. There was noticeable lag. Maybe if I had the component video card (PDA-5004) it would not be as bad, but no way am I giving up the analog RGB video card (PDA-5003) already installed.




it probably wouldn't matter which input card you use as most things out of the PS2 will be interlaced regardless of color space, so if you're feeling a measurable amount of input lag with interlaced content that's just how it's going to be. something interesting you could try is setting the PlayStation 2 to output 960i or 1080i using the GSM Selector. some displays will have less input lag with higher interlaced resolutions. (you could probably test those resolutions from a PC using your video card's custom resolution profile)

I've actually had really good luck with some of the later Samsung plasmas when using a PS2 outputting at either 960i or 1080i (you could also try using progressive resolutions but I've had less luck with those when using the GSM selector).

although some displays don't like the PS2's sync on green signal at higher resolutions, to fix that I use a cheap component to HDMI digitizer. doesn't add any input lag and makes all of your component video game consoles HDMI/DVI enabled (some displays do a better job processing from their digital input anyway).

Jfonzy wrote:
Unfortunately, Dot by dot is only selectable for the PC inputs. But yeah, even if you could do it for 240p, it would be tiny. Now if I could go console > RGB > line doubler > VGA, we might be on to something. As long as the line doubler doesn't introduce lag. First I just need to get a VGA box for my dreamcast to try..


the only line doublers designed for video gaming would probably be the OSSC or the older XRGB's. (as the frame Meister is a scaler and has a fairly considerable amount of input lag).


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 1:51 am 



Joined: 14 Sep 2016
Posts: 16
Another cool advantage of this plasma: live streaming using the display's multiscreen setting. My 240p game on the right, my stream on the PC via HDMI > DVI on the left. Check it out.


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:17 am 


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Joined: 11 May 2015
Posts: 500
Location: America
that's pretty cool Jfonzy, seems like this display has a lot of versatility and extra features that make it stand out among other models of plasma display. I'm glad it's working out for you. I Hope you get many years of enjoyment :)

have you tested 480p titles/sources yet?


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:03 am 



Joined: 14 Sep 2016
Posts: 16
Blair wrote:
that's pretty cool Jfonzy, seems like this display has a lot of versatility and extra features that make it stand out among other models of plasma display. I'm glad it's working out for you. I Hope you get many years of enjoyment :)

have you tested 480p titles/sources yet?


Thanks, I hope so, too!

Tomorrow I'm going to try to boot into 480p mode on my PS2 and use YPbPr over RGB and see how it goes..


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 Post subject: Re: Plasma people: Pioneer 60" PDP-607CMX?
PostPosted: Fri Aug 18, 2017 12:52 am 



Joined: 14 Sep 2016
Posts: 16
Short demo of 480p running on the display on PS2 component cable via RGB inputs with RCA>BNC adapters. Works well!


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