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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:46 pm 



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I feel sorry for anyone who has used a flashcart. It's most likely used up a portion of your console's lifespan.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:47 pm 


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Guspaz wrote:
It would be on a case-by-case basis depending on the repro cart design. In theory, a repro/homebrew cart can be as bad as the worst console-killing multicarts. Take that 8-bit music power cart for example, it fed 5v directly to the 3.3v flash. That's a recipe for a quick death for the console.


That's what I feared. I think I only have one or two, but I'd have no idea how to check them unfortunately.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 8:58 pm 


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Tweet good high-res photos of both sides of the PCB at René and he'll give you an opinion on it.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:06 pm 


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GeneraLight wrote:
I feel sorry for anyone who has used a flashcart. It's most likely used up a portion of your console's lifespan.

LOL nope

I've been using various flash carts on pretty much all of my consoles for years now, and nothing has ever happened to them because of flash carts. People are just being massive alarmists over a minor design flaw and it's hilarious to watch IMO


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:22 pm 



Joined: 29 Nov 2016
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I have Everdrives for every system they are available for and I have no concern using them. Almost every console I own (16 of them) I bought broken and repaired. They're going to break regardless of whether I use Everdrives or official games. Everdrives + 2 consoles (main and backup) are a lot cheaper than collecting the official carts nowadays and I'm sure even with reduced life capacity, i'll get plenty use out of them. I'm not too concerned about the issue.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:23 pm 


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The Everdrive design flaw not being that big a deal? Sure. The multicarts/repros/pirates/etc that don't even have the resistors? I don't think that's being alarmist, it's not hard to find people who say "I used this cart in my console and now my console is dead".


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:32 pm 



Joined: 29 Nov 2016
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Guspaz wrote:
The Everdrive design flaw not being that big a deal? Sure. The multicarts/repros/pirates/etc that don't even have the resistors? I don't think that's being alarmist, it's not hard to find people who say "I used this cart in my console and now my console is dead".


To clarify, I was addressing the Everdrives only. I don't trust most homebrew or Chinese bootleg products. And I don't just hold electronics to that standard!


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 9:48 pm 



Joined: 26 Jan 2005
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I have two of those v1.2 Turbo Everdrives flashcarts myself and haven't had any problems with either one. So should I replace 'em with the newer v2.1 TE setup instead?

I admit that I do have one of those 161-in-1 Neo-Geo flash carts -- haven't tried boot it up yet and it still remains brand new. I'll have to open it up to see if it has the crappy voltage resistor mod in place or not. If not, then it won't be used.

So would I have to be concerned with my bootlegged Neo-Geo MVS Brinkger shmup flash cart as well?

PC Engine Fan X! ^_~


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 10:53 pm 


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What about Neo Geo AES conversions?


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 07, 2017 11:08 pm 


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Look at the ICs used in the conversion, and figure out their IO levels, and type (CMOS, NMOS, PMOS, etc).

The 161-in-1 and friends is bad, and harmful, no matter if it has a voltage regulator or some diodes to drop the main supply.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 3:16 am 



Joined: 26 Nov 2011
Posts: 130
The flash cart being damaged maybe. But the console? I'll have to err on the side of skepticism.
More likely you'd see damage to a console by using flash carts that demand too much power. Rather than being given too much power.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 3:48 am 


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theclaw wrote:
The flash cart being damaged maybe. But the console? I'll have to err on the side of skepticism.
More likely you'd see damage to a console by using flash carts that demand too much power. Rather than being given too much power.


The extra power has to go somewhere right? I'm no electrical engineer but I could see it doubling back to the console in some way.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 3:56 am 



Joined: 26 Nov 2011
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bobrocks95 wrote:
theclaw wrote:
The flash cart being damaged maybe. But the console? I'll have to err on the side of skepticism.
More likely you'd see damage to a console by using flash carts that demand too much power. Rather than being given too much power.


The extra power has to go somewhere right? I'm no electrical engineer but I could see it doubling back to the console in some way.


Hmm. I didn't consider the effects of bad grounding, or worse a short circuit.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 6:05 am 


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I think some skepticism is healthy on both ends, at all times. If Krikzz has a product that isn’t where it needs to be– he needs some help (or more competition) to make it right IMO. The SD2SNES in terms of software presentation alone, is miles ahead that of the Genesis’ Mega Everdrive. Flash carts are all amazing, and Krikzz is amazing, but the SD2SNES is a cut above the rest.

Basically, I agree on both sides- but mostly that Krikzz should fix any outstanding issues (software, presentation, and hardware)- and I also think there may be a need for some competition to “up the antes” at this point. The SD2SNES is awesome– I wish it existed on all consoles in even it’s current form.

ApolloBoy wrote:
GeneraLight wrote:
I feel sorry for anyone who has used a flashcart. It's most likely used up a portion of your console's lifespan.

LOL nope

I've been using various flash carts on pretty much all of my consoles for years now, and nothing has ever happened to them because of flash carts. People are just being massive alarmists over a minor design flaw and it's hilarious to watch IMO


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 6:10 am 


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As I understand it, the SD2SNES is just sold by Krikzz. he didn't design or program for it. so that could be why it's so different from the everdrive lineup.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 7:08 am 


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The SD2SNES was designed by Ikari (it's actually opensource, including both the PCB design and the firmware), but he does not manufacture or sell it, he just works on the hardware/firmware design. Krikzz is the primary manufacturer of it, although since it's opensource, not the only. You could even make one yourself if you really wanted to and potentially save some money, but you'd probably have to make multiple of them (hard to get just one PCB), and it'd be a ton of fine-pitched soldering.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 8:33 am 


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I just got done attenuating the csync in all my RGB cables, and now this!

Thankfully only one of my Everdrives is in any doubt, which is the "X7" one for the Mega Drive. Although in the case of that one, the review he posted seemed more 'unsure' despite the verdict being to "avoid".
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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:28 am 



Joined: 18 Oct 2015
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I have Everdrives for my Mega Drive, GBA, N64 and Game Gear, and tbh, as much as I respect Rene's opinion, I'm not worried about my consoles. Most of them I don't play on a regular basis, so if and when they do eventually fail, I'll either repair it, or just replace it.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 9:45 am 


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FBX wrote:
I just got done attenuating the csync in all my RGB cables, and now this!

Thankfully only one of my Everdrives is in any doubt, which is the "X7" one for the Mega Drive. Although in the case of that one, the review he posted seemed more 'unsure' despite the verdict being to "avoid".


What do you mean by attenuating the csync in all RGB cables? I got my RGB cables from retro gaming accesoiries on ebay, positive these are highest quality you can get.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 11:40 am 


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Magicalbottle wrote:
FBX wrote:
I just got done attenuating the csync in all my RGB cables, and now this!

Thankfully only one of my Everdrives is in any doubt, which is the "X7" one for the Mega Drive. Although in the case of that one, the review he posted seemed more 'unsure' despite the verdict being to "avoid".


What do you mean by attenuating the csync in all RGB cables? I got my RGB cables from retro gaming accesoiries on ebay, positive these are highest quality you can get.


I guess you haven't heard about the revelation they are not properly attenuated on the csync line, and still worse, some Genesis cables had 'boosting' circuitry added. Here's a link to Voultar's video on the subject and repairing one to proper csync attenuation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khl6x0S_bV0

After watching his video, I checked my SNES and Genesis cables, and sure enough, they were both missing the resistors needed to properly attenuate the csync line. I've since fixed both in the same way Voultar does in the video. It's a preventative measure from possibly damaging the Framemeister over so many years of use.

Below is RetroRGB's work in progress on what you need to attenuate the csync line for various consoles:

http://www.retrorgb.com/csync.html


.
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Last edited by FBX on Sat Jul 08, 2017 8:05 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 12:30 pm 



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FBX wrote:
After watching his video, I checked my SNES and NES cables, and sure enough, they were both missing the resistors needed to properly attenuate the csync line.


Did you also check the console plug? According to viletim the resistor should be at the console end.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:33 pm 



Joined: 09 Apr 2012
Posts: 1929
GeneraLight wrote:
I feel sorry for anyone who has used a flashcart. It's most likely used up a portion of your console's lifespan.

You do realize a lot of people use flash carts to pirate rare games right? The cost of very occasionally replacing a console is minuscule compared to the cost of just a few of the rarest games on some systems. Hell even without the piracy angle I'm sure people with legit copies of those games would rather have some wear and tear on their console than their expensive cartridges. SNES consoles are cheap, but if you somehow break your copy of Earthbound that's going to be expensive.

That's not even going into that without a flash cartridge you miss out on some fantastic fan translated games.

Sure this is the sort of thing that should be addressed but have some perspective.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:43 pm 



Joined: 25 Jun 2016
Posts: 60
What about the Everdrive-64 V3? You would think that would be popular enough to test and I would really like to know the results as I own one.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 1:58 pm 


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Wolf_ wrote:
What about the Everdrive-64 V3? You would think that would be popular enough to test and I would really like to know the results as I own one.

It's mentioned in the article. Since the N64 provides 3.3V this issue doesn't apply to N64 flash carts.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 3:49 pm 


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FBX wrote:
Magicalbottle wrote:
FBX wrote:
I just got done attenuating the csync in all my RGB cables, and now this!

Thankfully only one of my Everdrives is in any doubt, which is the "X7" one for the Mega Drive. Although in the case of that one, the review he posted seemed more 'unsure' despite the verdict being to "avoid".


What do you mean by attenuating the csync in all RGB cables? I got my RGB cables from retro gaming accesoiries on ebay, positive these are highest quality you can get.


I guess you haven't heard about the revelation they are not properly attenuated on the csync line, and still worse, some Genesis cables had 'boosting' circuitry added. Here's a link to Voultar's video on the subject and repairing one to proper csync attenuation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=khl6x0S_bV0

After watching his video, I checked my SNES and NES cables, and sure enough, they were both missing the resistors needed to properly attenuate the csync line. I've since fixed both in the same way Voultar does in the video. It's a preventative measure from possibly damaging the Framemeister over so many years of use.

Below is RetroRGB's work in progress on what you need to attenuate the csync line for various consoles:

http://www.retrorgb.com/csync.html


.


Hmm, when I contacted her about that I thought she said she did have extra circuitry to bring it down to 75 ohms. If I check the sync pins with a multimeter will I see 75 ohms resistance if the circuitry is there and less or nearly none if it isn't?


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 3:53 pm 


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Quote:
If I check the sync pins with a multimeter will I see 75 ohms resistance if the circuitry is there and less or nearly none if it isn't?

you can easily check the peak voltage between the sync pin and a gnd pin of your choice. Just run a game of which you know that it shows a white screen at some point during it's start sequence (e.g. Sonic 2).


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 4:54 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
Quote:
If I check the sync pins with a multimeter will I see 75 ohms resistance if the circuitry is there and less or nearly none if it isn't?

you can easily check the peak voltage between the sync pin and a gnd pin of your choice. Just run a game of which you know that it shows a white screen at some point during it's start sequence (e.g. Sonic 2).


I'm seeing TTL sync as peaking around 5V and 75 ohm sync peaking around 1V, is that right?


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:10 pm 


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Quote:
I'm seeing TTL sync as peaking around 5V and 75 ohm sync peaking around 1V, is that right?

depends on the cable config. Since the MD CSYNC signal requires a buffer anyway a lower rated resistor might be already in use, so you really might end up with anything between these two nominal peak levels.


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 5:26 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
Quote:
I'm seeing TTL sync as peaking around 5V and 75 ohm sync peaking around 1V, is that right?

depends on the cable config. Since the MD CSYNC signal requires a buffer anyway a lower rated resistor might be already in use, so you really might end up with anything between these two nominal peak levels.


Hmm, to rephrase- if the voltage is above 1V by a significant amount, is it reasonable to assume it's not properly attenuated to 75 ohms?


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 Post subject: Re: Everdrives could cause damages...?
PostPosted: Sat Jul 08, 2017 8:10 pm 


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paulb_nl wrote:
FBX wrote:
After watching his video, I checked my SNES and Genesis cables, and sure enough, they were both missing the resistors needed to properly attenuate the csync line.


Did you also check the console plug? According to viletim the resistor should be at the console end.


First I need to apologize for the brain fart, I meant I checked my SNES and Genesis cables. I use the SNES cables on my NESRGB NES, which uses a SNES multi-out port.

At any rate, I tested with a multimeter and found it's very unlikely there's a resistor on the console end of the cables. On the SNES, I got a reading of 4.6V, and on the Genesis a reading of 4.28V. I added in the resistor on both, and they worked perfectly when I plugged them back into the Framemeister.

Fudoh wrote:
you can easily check the peak voltage between the sync pin and a gnd pin of your choice. Just run a game of which you know that it shows a white screen at some point during it's start sequence (e.g. Sonic 2).


Or use Artemio's 240p Test Suit on an Everdrive, but... Oh wait... :-P
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