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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:13 pm 


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Location: Bellevue, Washington, USA
superg wrote:
Composite signal is passed as is if sync regeneration is off. If sync regeneration is on, it's stripping everything from composite but sync, so it becomes CSYNC.


That part is indeed news to me. I figured that with sync regen on it would forward composite as-is on the composite pin. And generate a CSYNC signal from composite on the CSYNC pin.

EDIT: Although, I guess the presence of a CSYNC signal without an accompanying RGB signal would throw lots of equipment capable of handling both RGBS and composite from a scart connector for a loop.
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Last edited by DirkSwizzler on Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:17 pm 



Joined: 09 May 2017
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superg wrote:
Sunray wrote:
Just got mine and did a quick test. Two consoles does not work for me:

1) Unmodded PAL NES with a composite video to SCART cable. Just a black picture.

2) Unmodded PC Engine Core Grafx + Super Grafx with a custom made RGB SCART that attaches to the EXT port on the back. Black picture with sync regeneration off or grey/black flickering with sync regeneration on. Cable says "CV-SYNC EDITION" on it, not sure if that means composite video or not. I'll ask the maker of the cable. Link here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Scart-RGB-Cable ... xyaRZR2X4C

Everything works when connected to a dumb SCART switch. Any ideas?

1. As I've stated here, there is no conversion from composite to RGB. This is RGBS switch.
2. Ext connector cable isn't enough to get proper RGBS from turbografx, read this topic backwards, there is some stuff from dbelectronics which works as far as I remember.


1. I though composite video was passed through if sync regeneration was off? I'm not looking for a conversion.
2. Not sure why it wouldn't be enough. There is a built in RGB amp.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:04 pm 


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Sunray wrote:
superg wrote:
Sunray wrote:
Just got mine and did a quick test. Two consoles does not work for me:

1) Unmodded PAL NES with a composite video to SCART cable. Just a black picture.

2) Unmodded PC Engine Core Grafx + Super Grafx with a custom made RGB SCART that attaches to the EXT port on the back. Black picture with sync regeneration off or grey/black flickering with sync regeneration on. Cable says "CV-SYNC EDITION" on it, not sure if that means composite video or not. I'll ask the maker of the cable. Link here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Scart-RGB-Cable ... xyaRZR2X4C

Everything works when connected to a dumb SCART switch. Any ideas?

1. As I've stated here, there is no conversion from composite to RGB. This is RGBS switch.
2. Ext connector cable isn't enough to get proper RGBS from turbografx, read this topic backwards, there is some stuff from dbelectronics which works as far as I remember.


1. I though composite video was passed through if sync regeneration was off? I'm not looking for a conversion.
2. Not sure why it wouldn't be enough. There is a built in RGB amp.

NES: Usually the composite video is passed through fine, but how exactly are you taking that composite output in your TV? Do you have a SCART->RCA adapter and do you connect it using yellow connector to one of your TV analog inputs?
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:43 pm 



Joined: 12 May 2017
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FBX wrote:
For clarification (unless I'm reading franckytaz's post wrong) the input down at the bottom of the image is his N64. He states he is using a yellow-white-red cable, which we all know is composite video and stereo audio. In this case, he's thinking he can use composite video into the gscartsw-lite, which doesn't work because gscartsw-lite doesn't translate composite into RGB.



That post is totally true, it's exactly my setup. The input down at the bottom isN64.

Like I said, the input at the top (scart to red/white audio) is a separate output for sound (to my 2.1 speaker).

The other output is obviously scart to TV output.

I think I now understand the difference between composite and RGB signal, I have to mod (so open and work inside) my N64 to change the signal from compiste to RGB in order to have the picture on screen (Am I right ?)

So I'm going to check on the web some tutorial to do that :S

Thanks everybody


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 10:47 pm 



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franckytaz wrote:
FBX wrote:
For clarification (unless I'm reading franckytaz's post wrong) the input down at the bottom of the image is his N64. He states he is using a yellow-white-red cable, which we all know is composite video and stereo audio. In this case, he's thinking he can use composite video into the gscartsw-lite, which doesn't work because gscartsw-lite doesn't translate composite into RGB.



That post is totally true, it's exactly my setup. The input down at the bottom is N64.

Like I said, the input at the top (scart to red/white audio) is a separate output for sound (to my 2.1 speaker).

The other output is obviously scart to TV output.

I think I now understand the difference between composite and RGB signal, I have to mod (so open and work inside) my N64 to change the signal from compiste to RGB in order to have the picture on screen (Am I right ?)

So I'm going to check on the web some tutorial to do that :S

Thanks everybody


PS : For the record yes I have and old Sony trinitron TV, so the gscartw is directly plugged into TV scart input, I don't have any framemaster or upscaler.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 11:04 pm 


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franckytaz wrote:
PS : For the record yes I have and old Sony trinitron TV, so the gscartw is directly plugged into TV scart input, I don't have any framemaster or upscaler.


Ah, all my assumptions were wrong then. So it sounds like turning sync regen off will allow the composite pin to pass through until you RGB mod for maximum awesomeness.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 3:49 am 


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franckytaz wrote:
FBX wrote:
For clarification (unless I'm reading franckytaz's post wrong) the input down at the bottom of the image is his N64. He states he is using a yellow-white-red cable, which we all know is composite video and stereo audio. In this case, he's thinking he can use composite video into the gscartsw-lite, which doesn't work because gscartsw-lite doesn't translate composite into RGB.



That post is totally true, it's exactly my setup. The input down at the bottom isN64.

Like I said, the input at the top (scart to red/white audio) is a separate output for sound (to my 2.1 speaker).

The other output is obviously scart to TV output.

I think I now understand the difference between composite and RGB signal, I have to mod (so open and work inside) my N64 to change the signal from compiste to RGB in order to have the picture on screen (Am I right ?)

So I'm going to check on the web some tutorial to do that :S

Thanks everybody

Yes, that is correct!
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:25 am 



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superg wrote:
franckytaz wrote:
FBX wrote:
For clarification (unless I'm reading franckytaz's post wrong) the input down at the bottom of the image is his N64. He states he is using a yellow-white-red cable, which we all know is composite video and stereo audio. In this case, he's thinking he can use composite video into the gscartsw-lite, which doesn't work because gscartsw-lite doesn't translate composite into RGB.



That post is totally true, it's exactly my setup. The input down at the bottom isN64.

Like I said, the input at the top (scart to red/white audio) is a separate output for sound (to my 2.1 speaker).

The other output is obviously scart to TV output.

I think I now understand the difference between composite and RGB signal, I have to mod (so open and work inside) my N64 to change the signal from compiste to RGB in order to have the picture on screen (Am I right ?)

So I'm going to check on the web some tutorial to do that :S

Thanks everybody

Yes, that is correct!



Dammmmmmn it ! Let's go ! (I will come back after when I will have totally destroyed my N64 :P)


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:46 am 


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franckytaz wrote:

Dammmmmmn it ! Let's go ! (I will come back after when I will have totally destroyed my N64 :P)


Start here:

http://retrorgb.com/n64rgbcompatible.html


-FBX
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 7:56 am 


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franckytaz wrote:
Dammmmmmn it ! Let's go ! (I will come back after when I will have totally destroyed my N64 :P)


Hopefully you can indulge me just because I have to know beyond a shadow of a doubt. Can you at least try turning sync regen off and see if the video shows up on your TV as superg stated?

I realize he's the engineer on this thing so he would know what he's talking about. But it just seems so counter intuitive to me that I have to know for a fact that it working as expected in this specific case.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:39 am 



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superg wrote:
NES: Usually the composite video is passed through fine, but how exactly are you taking that composite output in your TV? Do you have a SCART->RCA adapter and do you connect it using yellow connector to one of your TV analog inputs?


Ok now I understand the problem.

No I use a fully wired SCART cable from the gscart to a CRT (AV1). Normally this will just work with both composite and RGB (or S-video) over the same cable since European TVs support both on the same input, that's the beauty of it. SCART pin 16 tells the TV if the signal is either composite or RGB. Now it seems that the gscart isn't fully switched on all pins making the TV think everything is in RGB which results in a black screen for composite signals.

Now, I can get around this by using a SCART->RCA adapter on the second gscart output and connect the yellow cable to AV2 on the CRT (just tested this and it works). This way I can play composite systems on AV2 and RGB system on AV1. That is fine with me, but in the end it is just a hack. With my old manual SCART switch or Hydra I can connect everything to AV1, but again, no big deal.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:45 am 



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Oh my god I opened my N64 and see with some pain that I have a DENC-NUS chip... Europeen PAL console, the most difficult to mod (I checked there http://forums.modretro.com/index.php?th ... uest.1417/ :cry: )

So the best method is there http://etim.net.au/n64rgb/instructions-new/#input2 (around at the middle of the page, DENC-NUS method)


Well... It's not even the metohd that scares me, it's the price (and the mess).

If I add the price of the N64RGB board and the time/risk to mod my N64, I think it would be a better choice to sell my N64 then by a RGB modded N64, don't you think ?

DirkSwizzler I will test again with Csync OFF then back to you.


I think I even will earn a few money selling mine then getting like this one http://www.ebay.fr/itm/Console-Nintendo ... SwiDFYNuQe (for PAL games, cause of course I only have PAL game).


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 8:55 am 



Joined: 20 Feb 2016
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DirkSwizzler wrote:
That part is indeed news to me. I figured that with sync regen on it would forward composite as-is on the composite pin. And generate a CSYNC signal from composite on the CSYNC pin.


CSYNC, composite video and luma sync are the same pin on the SCART connector.

franckytaz wrote:
I think I now understand the difference between composite and RGB signal, I have to mod (so open and work inside) my N64 to change the signal from compiste to RGB in order to have the picture on screen (Am I right ?)


You can turn sync regeneration off and connect a composite video cable to your output SCART adapter. Or switch your TV SCART input to Composite video but that will be a hassle switching back and forth between Composite video and RGB.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 9:29 am 



Joined: 12 May 2017
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paulb_nl wrote:
DirkSwizzler wrote:
That part is indeed news to me. I figured that with sync regen on it would forward composite as-is on the composite pin. And generate a CSYNC signal from composite on the CSYNC pin.


CSYNC, composite video and luma sync are the same pin on the SCART connector.

franckytaz wrote:
I think I now understand the difference between composite and RGB signal, I have to mod (so open and work inside) my N64 to change the signal from compiste to RGB in order to have the picture on screen (Am I right ?)


You can turn sync regeneration off and connect a composite video cable to your output SCART adapter. Or switch your TV SCART input to Composite video but that will be a hassle switching back and forth between Composite video and RGB.




Yeah, I bought the gscartw not to have to touch anything during gaming session, I guess that's the best advantage of the product. You just have to turn off and on the differents consoles, and enjoy.

DirkSwizzler I checked again with sync off and on, only sound. I put directly to TV, sound and picture OK. N64 version issue :/

If I'm well understanding this things, my old TV accept both signal (composite and RGB) on one scart input. So two cases, it converts composite to RGB (inside TV? I guess not) or accept both, identificate the active one then autoswitch itself to show picture and sound (my best shot).

I just found a second RGB SNES cable that seems to fit for my future not-bought-yet modded N64 :D So I just have to buy a modded one.

What a wonderful topic here, thanks everybody for all free help you give to beginners.


(Is my english bad ? Hell yeah)


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Sat Aug 12, 2017 4:06 pm 


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paulb_nl wrote:
DirkSwizzler wrote:
That part is indeed news to me. I figured that with sync regen on it would forward composite as-is on the composite pin. And generate a CSYNC signal from composite on the CSYNC pin.


CSYNC, composite video and luma sync are the same pin on the SCART connector.


WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA. That's what I get for not actually reading the SCART pinout. I had assumed that the Nintendo A/V Multi-out had each pin fully represented on the SCART plug, and multi-out has a different pin for CSYNC vs Composite vs S-Video.

Thanks for enlightening me. I understand why there's no way my mental model could work.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 12:45 am 



Joined: 12 Jun 2017
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Hay superg do u have a timetable for the next batch of gscartsw_lite and gcompsw? I really don't want to miss the window


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:18 am 



Joined: 25 May 2017
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So will you be selling the extras this week superg?


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:20 am 


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Ward1986 wrote:
So will you be selling the extras this week superg?

I have to assemble and test the extra units first. They might go on sale early next week.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:30 pm 



Joined: 30 May 2017
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I also received my lite and I couldn't be happier. EVERYTHING JUST WORKS :)

My chain is:
Console > gscart lite > OSSC > DVDO iScan Duo > TV (Panasonic Plasma)

More specifically:
Saturn (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (Sync unknown) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

MD2/32x (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (Sync unknown) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

PS2 Slim (PAL)---cheap RGB Scart cable (Sync unknown) off eBay---gscart---WORKS (of course only 240p/480i until superg releases his fabled RGsB cable :)

SNES (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (Sync on Luma) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

Gamecube (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (CSYNC) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

Dreamcast (PAL)---Toro Box---Scart cable (regular male to male)---gscart---WORKS (if sync regen is on, the picture begins to wobble slightly, so I just keep it off permanently. All other consoles don't need it either. Another little quirk: Sometimes, the picture is warped or vastly magnified (only the top third of the image is stretched across the whole screen... but turning the OSSC off and on again fixes this. So no big deal. It's also worth mentioning that the gscart+OSSC combo accepts both the 480i and 480p signal the Toro can output over Scart)

The gscart is now the crown jewel of my setup becuse I now don't have to reach for some manual Scart switch anymore and guess which port is assigned to which console. Just plug and play, yay!

Here's a picture of my setup. It's designed to disappear under my bed. That black surface the consoles stand on is a piece of wood with tiny rolls under it, so it works like a drawer. The only things left do to are: Giving the NES an RGB mod and waiting for superg's PS2 RGsB adapter. The N64 doesn't appear in the list above b/c it was outfitted with UltraHDMI :)

https://www.pic-upload.de/view-33741637/IMG_8195.jpg.html

https://www.pic-upload.de/view-33741638/IMG_8197.jpg.html

Thank you so much for the great stuff, superg!


Last edited by hyne on Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:57 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:34 pm 


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hyne wrote:
I also received my lite and I couldn't be happier. EVERYTHING JUST WORKS :)

My chain is:
Console > gscart lite > OSSC > DVDO iScan Duo > TV (Panasonic Plasma)

More specifically:
Saturn (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (Sync unknown) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

MD2/32x (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (Sync unknown) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

PS2 Slim (PAL)---cheap RGB Scart cable (Sync unknown) off eBay---gscart---WORKS (of course only 240p/480i until superg releases his fabled RGsB cable :)

SNES (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (Sync on Luma) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

Gamecube (PAL)---RGB Scart cable (CSYNC) by retrogamingcables---gscart---WORKS

Dreamcast (PAL)---Toro Box---Scart cable (regular male to male)---gscart---WORKS (if sync regen is on, the picture begins to wobble slightly, so I just keep it off permanently. All other consoles don't need it either. Another little quirk: Sometimes, the picture is warped or vastly magnified (only the top third of the image is stretched across the whole screen... but turning the OSSC off and on again fixes this. So no big deal. It's also worth mentioning that the gscart+OSSC combo accepts both the 480i and 480p signal the Toro can output over Scart)

The gscart is now the crown jewel of my setup becuse I now don't have to reach for some manual Scart switch anymore and guess which port is assigned to which console. Just plug and play, yay!

Here's a picture of my setup. It's designed to disappear under my bed. That black surface the consoles stand on is a piece of wood with tiny rolls under it, so it works like a drawer. The only things left do to are: Giving the NES an RGB mod and waiting for superg's PS2 RGsB adapter :)
Thank you so much for the great stuff, superg!

Thanks for the feedback, I appreciate it!
The picture links seem broken though.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:58 pm 


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superg wrote:
Ward1986 wrote:
So will you be selling the extras this week superg?

I have to assemble and test the extra units first. They might go on sale early next week.

Yeah! Bring it on! :D


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 1:59 pm 



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Embedding the photos somehow didn't work. I now replaced them with simple URLs :)


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 4:09 pm 



Joined: 23 Dec 2016
Posts: 19
Sunray wrote:
superg wrote:
Sunray wrote:
Just got mine and did a quick test. Two consoles does not work for me:

1) Unmodded PAL NES with a composite video to SCART cable. Just a black picture.

2) Unmodded PC Engine Core Grafx + Super Grafx with a custom made RGB SCART that attaches to the EXT port on the back. Black picture with sync regeneration off or grey/black flickering with sync regeneration on. Cable says "CV-SYNC EDITION" on it, not sure if that means composite video or not. I'll ask the maker of the cable. Link here: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Scart-RGB-Cable ... xyaRZR2X4C

Everything works when connected to a dumb SCART switch. Any ideas?

1. As I've stated here, there is no conversion from composite to RGB. This is RGBS switch.
2. Ext connector cable isn't enough to get proper RGBS from turbografx, read this topic backwards, there is some stuff from dbelectronics which works as far as I remember.


1. I though composite video was passed through if sync regeneration was off? I'm not looking for a conversion.
2. Not sure why it wouldn't be enough. There is a built in RGB amp.


You have to use a amp of some kind for any tg16/pce console. They don't output properly attenuated RGB signals despite having RGB output from the 6260.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 6:46 pm 



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Mobiusstriptech wrote:
You have to use a amp of some kind for any tg16/pce console. They don't output properly attenuated RGB signals despite having RGB output from the 6260.


The cable have an amp built-in. Anyway, I contacted the seller and he said he now have an improved version of the amp that works with the GSCARTSW and he will upgrade my cable. Yay!


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:13 pm 



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Got my gscartsw_lite and now realised I should've ordered a gcompsw as well.

Will there be a new batch?


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:30 pm 


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chromium wrote:
Got my gscartsw_lite and now realised I should've ordered a gcompsw as well.

Will there be a new batch?

There will be a batch later for sure but at this point I don't have any schedule.
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 10:45 pm 



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superg wrote:
chromium wrote:
Got my gscartsw_lite and now realised I should've ordered a gcompsw as well.

Will there be a new batch?

There will be a batch later for sure but at this point I don't have any schedule.


Great thanks. Not in any rush. I'll keep my eyes on this thread :)


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Tue Aug 15, 2017 11:45 pm 


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superg wrote:
chromium wrote:
Got my gscartsw_lite and now realised I should've ordered a gcompsw as well.

Will there be a new batch?

There will be a batch later for sure but at this point I don't have any schedule.


I'm in the same boat as chromium, so you'll definitely get more business. :-)

-FBX
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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 2:01 am 


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Joined: 07 Jun 2017
Posts: 11
franckytaz wrote:
franckytaz wrote:
FBX wrote:
For clarification (unless I'm reading franckytaz's post wrong) the input down at the bottom of the image is his N64. He states he is using a yellow-white-red cable, which we all know is composite video and stereo audio. In this case, he's thinking he can use composite video into the gscartsw-lite, which doesn't work because gscartsw-lite doesn't translate composite into RGB.



That post is totally true, it's exactly my setup. The input down at the bottom is N64.

Like I said, the input at the top (scart to red/white audio) is a separate output for sound (to my 2.1 speaker).

The other output is obviously scart to TV output.

I think I now understand the difference between composite and RGB signal, I have to mod (so open and work inside) my N64 to change the signal from compiste to RGB in order to have the picture on screen (Am I right ?)

So I'm going to check on the web some tutorial to do that :S

Thanks everybody


PS : For the record yes I have and old Sony trinitron TV, so the gscartw is directly plugged into TV scart input, I don't have any framemaster or upscaler.


I believe Superg has said that pin 16 on the outputs always outputs 5v 500mA in case you need to power something like an RGB to component board etc. In your case this would force your TV into RGB mode always, even when you are just sending composite video on pin 20.

The only solution I can think to having both is to install a switch in one end of your male male scart cable (spst) that disconnects pin 16 from your TV, switching it to composite video mode (=0V). Not sure of any way to do this automatically.


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 Post subject: Re: gscartsw / gscartsw_lite / gcompsw switches support thre
PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2017 6:05 am 



Joined: 16 Aug 2017
Posts: 1
superg wrote:
Ward1986 wrote:
So will you be selling the extras this week superg?

I have to assemble and test the extra units first. They might go on sale early next week.


I really hope you save some to put up on Thursday! That's my payday! :wink:


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