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 Post subject: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 5:57 pm 


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Joined: 22 Jun 2011
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Location: Bedfordshire, England.
My Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 device turned up today,

Image

there has been some reports/fears that the device had problems capturing at a res of 720x240 and at 60fps, but i can confirm that using the RGB Input paired up with the SyncStrike works fine....

Image

And also NES, via the composite breakout cable that comes with the device (proprietary socket to s-video, 3 phone plugs).....

Image

Whilst its picking up the NES at 720x240 (240i???), it cant cpature anything at that res.....

Image

Have to change it to 720x480i for it to capture, guess it because its a composite video signal...will have to wait until i get a RetroN 5 or mod the NES for RGB before i can enjou a 240p signal no it

No ill effects i have noticed with the 15 or so minutes i have spent with the device so far, and a big plus point for me it isn't causing my CPU clock speed to throttle and lock it as full clock circles like my SC-500N1 PCI-E card did, even after closing the program down. One thing i have noticed is Micomsoft have decided to go with a VGA input for RGB and not DVI like with the SC-500N1...not a massive problem just means ill need to buy a VGA to VGA cable

Will be doing further testing with the 1080p 60fps recording on my 360 later one hopefully USB3 will be up to the task.


Last edited by lettuce on Tue Jul 23, 2013 7:21 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:14 pm 


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nice - thanks for the impression.

What about some lag measurements ? Does it seem as fast as the 500N1 to you ?


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:27 pm 


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Joined: 22 Jun 2011
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I have had a quick blast on Cybernator via the AmaRec program and havent noticed any lag!. Any suggestion on a program to test??

As said above have only been playing around with it for 20 minutes or so, so more testing is defiantly needed :D


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 6:33 pm 


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remember the lag testing sessions on that japanese site about the 500N1 ? I think the PC's secondary HDMI output was looped directly into the capture card and the capture window just placed beneath a stop swatch app.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 7:08 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
remember the lag testing sessions on that japanese site about the 500N1 ? I think the PC's secondary HDMI output was looped directly into the capture card and the capture window just placed beneath a stop swatch app.



Gotcha. Here ya go.....

Image

I have my main monitor on DVI input and then used the HDMI input om my GPU for the XCAPTURE, then set my desktop res to 1080p and used duplicate display via windows Screen Resolution window.

Just used 'Print Screen' and then pasted it into paint to see the lag


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 7:38 pm 


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thanks a lot! 44ms is kinda ok, but higher than I would hoped for. Would you mind to try to same once again with disabled aero ? I think this saved one frame of lag on the 500N1.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 7:57 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
thanks a lot! 44ms is kinda ok, but higher than I would hoped for. Would you mind to try to same once again with disabled aero ? I think this saved one frame of lag on the 500N1.



Thats enabling the option, 'Invalidate Desktop composition.(Win7)' within AmaRec right??....

Image

Also dont forget this is at 1080p whilst the 500N1 would have been at 720p


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:08 pm 


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Might be better idea to disable it in W7 directly.

Disable Aero / Windows 7:

Choose Start > Control Panel > Personalization.
Select any of the themes in the Basic And High Contrast Themes category.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:19 pm 


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Hmmm, strange, seems to make it worse!?.....

Image

For comparison heres the 500N1, with aero STILL enabled within AmaRec and windows 7....

Image


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:27 pm 


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Im not actual sure this test can be trusted. I just tried the test 3 times (stopping and starting each time) and each time the lag was different!!


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:28 pm 


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all very similar. If this 500N1 performs like this on your system, then I guess you can say that the XCapture-1 performs exactly the same. That's good enough news. I hope to be able to test this myself soon. XCapture coming in soon, but I don't yet have USB3 on my PC.

Maybe you try something not Javascript-based and not running in the browser. MAME with a running frame counter or a racing game with a ms counter is usually a good idea.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 8:32 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
all very similar. If this 500N1 performs like this on your system, then I guess you can say that the XCapture-1 performs exactly the same. That's good enough news. I hope to be able to test this myself soon. XCapture coming in soon, but I don't yet have USB3 on my PC.

Maybe you try something not Javascript-based and not running in the browser. MAME with a running frame counter or a racing game with a ms counter is usually a good idea.


Thats an idea, how can i get a running frame counter in Mame again??

On what i posted just above, here the XCapture again and no lag what so ever.....

Image

guess as u said javascript is bad for testing


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:42 pm 


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For MAME, press F11 to make the frame counter and frameskip display visible.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 2:36 pm 



Joined: 04 Jul 2013
Posts: 133
Did they include component breakout cables or still expect people to go D-Terminal route?

I guess you could use the component breakout from the 500N1 (if they let you) but then you can't pass through unless you got another breakout cable.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 6:27 pm 


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Thrill wrote:
Did they include component breakout cables or still expect people to go D-Terminal route?

I guess you could use the component breakout from the 500N1 (if they let you) but then you can't pass through unless you got another breakout cable.


No they only supply 2 composite breakouts, 3 phono's (audio and video) and a S-video connection....not sure why they give you 2 cables that are the same though. But yeah you have to purchase the D-terminal if your wanting to connect say a XBOX1 up to it via component


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 6:29 pm 


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Ed Oscuro wrote:
For MAME, press F11 to make the frame counter and frameskip display visible.



Hmmm that just brings up the frame skip and game speed, ie


0/10 skip, 100%


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 6:36 pm 


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god, I once had a list around of MAME roms showing a ms counter on top and now I don't remember a single one.

You can try the classic one though: take a MD emulator, load Artemio's 240p test suite and use the lag test within. Those 8 large circles with numbers moving through them. You have have to average your results over a dozen snapshots. This is what I used before Leo's handheld device and it gives pretty solid results.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 9:36 pm 



Joined: 04 Jul 2013
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lettuce wrote:
not sure why they give you 2 cables that are the same though


Video passthrough to TV for lagless play (I assume it's lagless).

Thanks.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Wed Jul 24, 2013 10:17 pm 


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lettuce wrote:
Ed Oscuro wrote:
For MAME, press F11 to make the frame counter and frameskip display visible.



Hmmm that just brings up the frame skip and game speed, ie


0/10 skip, 100%

Get an alternate (better) build of MAME, i.e. MAME Plus! hosted on EMUcr is my usual go-to build. There may be others more to your liking.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 8:58 am 


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Have notice a strange tearing problem I'm getting along the top of the screen on my first PS3 capture I have done with this device, heres a part showing the problem.....

http://youtu.be/dLFbBgDILkI?t=4m

It's strange it doesnt do it all the time only on pans around the enviroment when I'm looking around slowly, and it's only ever at the top of the screen so don't think this its the usual sync issues?. I was using amarec to capture, Any ideas what might be causing this?


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:16 am 



Joined: 04 Jul 2013
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I noticed a slight tearing issue on the Amarec preview window when I was capturing 480p from my Wii using my new SC-512 but I forgot to check if it was in the encoded file (soon deleted it).

Are you sure the tearing is not just in the game? You would need to hook up to a TV to make sure.

Also by any chance do you have a 4K capture option with your capture card? I have one with my SC-512: http://i.imgur.com/Tl7Ifwz.png

It's theoretically just possible to capture 4K 60 with the 500MB/s bandwidth (since 1080p 60 is 248MB/s) on 422.


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:43 am 


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Your desktop needs some Fences and Rainmeter lovin :mrgreen:

So if this is lagless or very low lag, this could be a good Yokotate solution for Superguns and the like then?
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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:17 am 


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Thrill wrote:
It's theoretically just possible to capture 4K 60 with the 500MB/s bandwidth (since 1080p 60 is 248MB/s) on 422.


How did you calculate that? Wouldn't it be 1920x1080x59.94x16 /8/1024/1024 = 237MB/s for 1080p with 422 (16bit).
4K at full framerate would be 948MB/s with that equation. Also the devices that use 4K 60fps at the moment use 4 HDMI cables, the max the SC-512 could accept would be two HDMI cables into dual link. But I doubt that this will become a standard...


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:48 am 


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Location: Bedfordshire, England.
Thrill wrote:
Are you sure the tearing is not just in the game? You would need to hook up to a TV to make sure.

Also by any chance do you have a 4K capture option with your capture card? I have one with my SC-512: http://i.imgur.com/Tl7Ifwz.png

It's theoretically just possible to capture 4K 60 with the 500MB/s bandwidth (since 1080p 60 is 248MB/s) on 422.


I am actually playing it on my LCD tv whilst capturing and didn't notice the tearing at all, I use a 4/2 port HDMI switcher, so the HDMI cable from the micomsoft goes to the switcher and then from the switcher to my LCD tv. Its not the switcher that is causing this issue as I was using this setup with my old card and that had no issues at all. I wonder if it's the drivers that came on the cd or something else!?

Haven't noticed a 4k option just 1080p 60hz, but then I think it just detects whatever you have hooked up is capable of


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 11:37 am 



Joined: 04 Jul 2013
Posts: 133
Looked at the QandA of the SC-512 and it mentioned screen tearing.

(: Disembowelment tearing) Why is the occurrence of something like a horizontal line in the preview window.
Hardware over Leo Lee of Windows screen or not set to "on"?
You may: (disembowelment tearing) occurs something like a horizontal line in the preview window when the "on" hardware over Leo Lee.
(Please state or Aero is available), please set to the state of "semi-transparent" the frame of "window" to change the Windows theme from "Personal Settings". Hardware overlay will be "off" when the frame of the "window" is displayed in the "semi-transparent".

I guess enable/disable Aero?


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 12:23 pm 


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I'm trying to remember if the tearing was present in the preview window of amarec or not, I'll have to do some more testing tonight I guess


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:10 pm 


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I have figured out how to remove the tearing, i need to go into the AmaRec settings and click on The,

Capture device>Device Settings>Video decoder>Video standard

and change it from NTSC_M to PAL_60.

But i appear to only be able to do this in 1280x720 mode, if i change the device to 1920x1080 what ever i change the Video standard to it always reverts back to NTSC_M

is there anyway i can force 1080p mode to be on PAL_60??


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 9:41 pm 


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still weird, since there is no such thing as NTSC or PAL60 when it comes to HD timings...


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Thu Aug 08, 2013 10:39 pm 


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Fudoh wrote:
still weird, since there is no such thing as NTSC or PAL60 when it comes to HD timings...


Yeah ive been think about that, i think that its more to the point that i have changed the capture res from 1920x1080 down to 1280x720 rather than changing the Video standard!?

As i have noticed that even though i have the PS3 set to 1080p in the settings, THE LAST OF US game doesn't run at 1080p as my TV reports 720p when i start the game.....im guess this is whats causing the tearing problem that the game is 720p but i have 1080p set for capturing would this be a sound guess??


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 Post subject: Re: Micomsoft XCAPTURE-1 USB 3.0 Capture Unit
PostPosted: Fri Aug 09, 2013 12:08 pm 



Joined: 04 Jul 2013
Posts: 133
That's weird. I thought whatever you set your PS3 to that the PS3 console would just upscale to 1080p.

Maybe newer games don't do this as I looked at the back of the box and it does just state 480p or 720p: http://image.gamespotcdn.net/gamespot/i ... 3_back.jpg

You should be amazed you even got a 1080p image. No idea how it even worked.


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