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 Post subject: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 6:47 pm 



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http://www.joystiq.com/2010/08/18/suda- ... la-and-psn

Suda's doing a SHMUP?


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 6:55 pm 


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Oh, hell yeah! I like this guys ultra-strange style of games. Either this will be awesome, or a mess of awkward awesomeness that doesn't quite play right. Probably the latter... Can they hurry up and release No More Heroes on the 360 for everybody outside of Japan now.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 7:21 pm 


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Bizorre Jerry 5 meets euroshmup.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 8:10 pm 


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Yeah I predict pretty much something cool and bizarre to look at, but with a more euroshmuppy gameplay/game-features.
Who knows, maybe it'll work out better than we immagine.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:53 am 


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Has Suda ever really made a good game? I know it's super hip to pretend to like Killer 7, but I've just always thought his stuff was pretty terrible. The NHM series is the closest, but those are both pretty awful games if the humor doesn't grab you. My hope-o-meter for this one is flatlined.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:22 am 


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None of his games have ever even interested me so I have not even tried them. I only got a Wii less than a month ago though so maybe I'll give NMH a try sometime.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:48 am 


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8 1/2 wrote:
Has Suda ever really made a good game? I know it's super hip to pretend to like Killer 7, but I've just always thought his stuff was pretty terrible. The NHM series is the closest, but those are both pretty awful games if the humor doesn't grab you. My hope-o-meter for this one is flatlined.


I look at Suda51 like I look at Takeshi Miike. Brilliant, talented, but really far out there. I'll honestly and proudly tell you that I loved every second of Killer 7. Yes the gameplay was simple, but it didn't matter because I wasn't playing for the thrill of shooting, it was for the dark, twsited, weird and ultimately deep story. No More Heroes, while far strong on the gameplay front, works in much the same way. These are games you play for the world, not for the core mechanics.

Incidentally that's why i'm concerned about Suda making a shmup. You're pretty much guaranteed it won't play like anything we can expect, will probably suck for score competitions, but may also be a fun game to just sit and play, much in the same way Rez is. On the other hand Pure White Glastonberry and Bizarro Jerry 5 were interesting, albeit extremely rudimentary, so who really knows?
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:58 am 


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Suda's games are definetely more about the strange atmosphere and humor than the actual gameplay. It's like all his games balance on a very thin line between clever inside jokes and simply bad game design. The results are both hit and miss: Killer7 and NMH were really repetitive and irritating to play at times but they still have their own stand out moments which you don't find from any other games.

I'm interested to see how this project turns out but I'm not expecting something I would actually play even remotely seriously.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 2:19 am 


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Suda's games are like wacky animes where you're periodically forced to pause and play a Playstation 1 budget game. I kinda understand the soft spot appeal as I've bought terrible games (Phantasy Star 2) for the box art before.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 3:21 am 


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njiska wrote:
No More Heroes, while far strong on the gameplay front...


how so?
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:03 am 


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JoshF wrote:
I kinda understand the soft spot appeal as I've bought terrible games (Phantasy Star 2) for the box art before.

You don't like PS2's giant maze maps?

Hey, at least PSIII had crappy cover art so nobody thought they also had to buy the game.

I'd agree with the "PS1 budget game" bit except that Killer7 is a work of art throughout - yes, it's odd playing a movie where much of the time you're just holding the A button (on a GameCube) but whenever the game bits come up it feels natural enough for the environment.

Not sure any of these gameplay worries apply because Grasshopper is doing what it does - "provide art direction, music and sound." They don't even mention plot or story actually.

Anyway, I'll watch this one...since Treasure has the mopey shooting game story angle covered it'll be interesting to see what's cooked up in terms of the rationale for playing.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 7:17 am 


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Yo, Killer7 was awesome. Very fun, great visuals, and as you're not trying to make too much sense of the story, it's actually somewhat interesting. But yeah, that's the only one of his games that I truly like. NMH was ok, but not too good. I haven't played NMH2 yet, but I hear it's better.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:06 am 


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I like to watch people play his games, but I've never cared for them. I think I enjoy the presentation aspect more than anything.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:26 am 



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Any pictures or game footage????? I am just curious to look how it will turn out.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:08 pm 



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Quite like the poster art - not that this means much but I'd hope for more ikaruga than no more heroes... Anyway, hope its good - for right or wrong suda seems to garner some good press and I hope it rubs off on shmup interest in a good way. And not just for lol-crotch-boob-toilet-light-saber-irony dross...


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 12:59 pm 


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NMH series is just about one of the best things to happen to Wii. Killer 7 is pretty sweet in the later half.

The TLB in NMH1 on hardest is a treasured gaming moment. And Letz Shake.

I command the forum have slightly higher hopes for this shooting game.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:19 pm 



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game will have diesel punk visual style... not so much bullet hell shooter, but more like R-Type, strategic placement.

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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:38 pm 



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Just hope the game looks as good as the artwork. :shock:

Gameplay is something more to worry about though.


Last edited by RHE on Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:57 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 4:47 pm 


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I have somewhat high hopes for this. Suda 51's involvement holds promise, particularly for whatever visual flair/style the final product will have. That's not to say I'm totally worried about the gameplay in contrast; I believe it'll be at least competent in that area.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:09 pm 



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I think it will be good.. I guess I'm optimistic but come on, a new shmup for current-gen systems, and tied to Suda51.... Also it will have 3d stereoscopic support but I don't think that is a big deal, most games coming up are doing that, and I doubt it is going to mean the game will play horribly on non-3d sets.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:14 pm 


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I thought Killer7 was a work of art, so I've got high hopes for this. :mrgreen:
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 5:25 pm 


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For me, K7 had the best story and atmosphere, NMH had the best gameplay.

I haven't played a Wii game yet with combat as well controlled.

NMH's story wasn't bad, but K7 is a hard act to follow.

Some of the killers were awesome. Shame NMH2's plot was such a letdown.

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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:30 pm 



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Hello guys,

I'm from Digital Reality, Grasshopper's development partner on Sine Mora. Unfortunately, I'm not able to reveal much before we release more information about the game. So, some non-secret facts:

1. Every single member of the development team on our side is a hardcore STG fan.
2. Main influences behind the title: setting - Battle Garegga, gameplay - Einhander / R-Type.
3. Not a danmaku, but definitely not a euroshooter.
4. Our primary goal is to develop a game which is accessible to the newcomers and SIMULTANEOUSLY to implement solid gameplay mechanics which justify recording a superplay DVD.
5. More details soon (More details = trailer, screens. Soon = 2010).

Also, I'd like to thank you in advance for your feedback - we're watching this forum pretty regularly.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:43 pm 



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Welcome to shmups.com! What you say sounds pretty good, and hopefully this is going to be a solid game.

Reiker wrote:
4. Our primary goal is to develop a game which is accessible to the newcomers and SIMULTANEOUSLY to implement solid gameplay mechanics which justify recording a superplay DVD.


Wonder if this means there will be different modes to choose from like with Futari from CAVE. Making casuals and hardcore players lucky with one mode is very hard to do or even almost impossible.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:51 pm 


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8 1/2 wrote:
Has Suda ever really made a good game? I know it's super hip to pretend to like Killer 7, but I've just always thought his stuff was pretty terrible. The NHM series is the closest, but those are both pretty awful games if the humor doesn't grab you. My hope-o-meter for this one is flatlined.


i really like killer 7 and nmh (don't think he was involved with nmh2 was he?), but i think you're right, if you don't like the style/humour then the gameplay isn't going to make up for that.

i really liked the hold A to run around idea in killer 7 too, so many games give you fake freedom to run around endless corridors, but you can't really go anywhere or do anything the game doesn't want you to do anyway, so all that just seemed really streamlined in killer 7.

sorry for the OT. good to hear some of the developers are shmup fans :)


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 10:55 pm 


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Reiker wrote:
2. Main influences behind the title: setting - Battle Garegga, gameplay - Einhander / R-Type.

Awesome. Especially interested in the Einhander influence since a sequel will never happen.


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:28 pm 


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It's always nice to see random developer representatives show up on this board.

It would be nice to have a Suda game that is more fun to play than it is to just watch.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Thu Aug 19, 2010 11:46 pm 


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Reiker wrote:
Also, I'd like to thank you in advance for your feedback - we're watching this forum pretty regularly.


Well this is a pleasant surprise. Glad you know your audience.

I'm just glad that Garegga was your inspiration for setting and setting alone. Last thing I want is another rank system like that.
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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:09 am 



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Reiker wrote:
2. Main influences behind the title: setting - Battle Garegga, gameplay - Einhander / R-Type.

I like you guys already...

Quote:
3. Not a danmaku, but definitely not a euroshooter.

And now even more. Glad it's trying to avoid being a zzz shmup like Last Hope/Soldner X


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 Post subject: Re: Sine Mora(Suda 51 shmup)
PostPosted: Fri Aug 20, 2010 6:01 am 


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Reiker wrote:
2. Main influences behind the title: setting - Battle Garegga, gameplay - Einhander / R-Type.
3. Not a danmaku, but definitely not a euroshooter.


These two points make the game sound very appealing to me. There's really been too few non-danmaku shmups released in the recent years. Looking forward to this.
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